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Igb
11-15-2012, 08:33 PM
Hi guys, lets see if anyone can help me a bit with the problem I'm having, how to start...

I recently bought a Xonar Phoebus, It sounds great, but since it was new my guildmates noticed a background noise on my mic, relatively loud, they can understand me, but It's like having a electric engine next to the mic the whole time.

Well, i tried with my old mic, same happened, mic boost is disabled, and when i lower the volume the interference lowers with it but stays there. Ambience sound cancellation does not help.

But... what a surprise, i noticed the interference lowered sometimes... an finally found why. If i stress very hard my CPU (for example with intelburntest) the interference disappears completely (unless at very high volume/mic boost levels). Lower stress levels lower the interference aswell.

Tried to disable my overclock, no improvements... tried to disable C-states, and seems a bit better, but anyways i would prefer to no increase my system power consumption by a notable margin just to fix this. (I suspect the improvement is just for the extra consumption)

Extrange thing, when i stress my graphics cards (2 gtx 680) the interference gets louder and less consistent.

Whats the problem? Is it my psu? An "unclean" ground in my electric installation? A defective unit perhaps? sounds weird because the rest is working fine, and now i can reproduce the problem in the integrated sound card mic input aswell.
Im running a Seasonic Platinum 1000, don't think i could find a better and cleaner power supply (only real rival is probably AX1200i), my voltages (multimeter on hand) are rock solid (not even 0.1V off of their value in the worst cases), have no way to measure ripple but i have no reasons to think It's wrong.

The rest on my sistem is as follows:
Windows 7 x64 (tried both drivers, old and beta)
Rampage IV Extreme (3101 BIOS)
i7 3930k (tried without overclock aswell)
4x4gb g.skill ripjaws 1866mhz cl9
Vertex 4, Caviar Black, Caviar Green
2x gtx680

All watercooled.

Any suggestion is appreciated, many thanks for your time.

Best regards

Glasofruix
11-15-2012, 09:33 PM
Make sure your wires don't run along other wires. Try uninstalling/cleaning (driver sweeper, disable your onboard audio in bios)/reinstalling the drivers). Pull the card out, tape the part that touches the case with isolating duct tape and put it back. If that doesn't fix your problem, you might have a defective unit.

Igb
11-16-2012, 11:14 AM
i tested the cables at first, no luck, tried also reinstalling drivers (both versions) and disable the integrated realtek card, no improvements in either cases.
Still have to try isolating the back of the card as you say (it's quite hard to dismount it, since it's in the 3rd pciex, between the two cards, to keep both gpu's @x16, and i have to dismount the cooling first), but i have no much hopes in this, specially when the problem is getting solved with high CPU power consumption as i described.

Many thanks, still waiting for someone that can point the causes of this (if i can't get an easy solution, will be nice to know at least what is causing the problem, mobo, psu...)

Here is a little video showing the problem and how it completely dissapears under load (maybe the audio is not very clear, but the bar in the testing shows it perfectly): http://twitch.tv/ignaciobfp/b/340514433

WTC
11-16-2012, 12:33 PM
I don't have a clue, just a few questions: Where did you plug in your microphone? Directly back of the sound card or on the extension control box? Have you tried turning on ROG command of microphone effect? Not sure if that makes any difference....

Where's the sound in your video clip coming from? It sounds like the microphone recording being playback instantly.

Igb
11-16-2012, 01:41 PM
I tried both, the noise is there if i plug my mic directly, if i use the mic on the external module, or if i plug my mic to the module. Is not ambient noise, i have a physical "mute" button in my mic and the interferences remain.

I tried with ROG command, there is no noise supression (i guess what i have is "random" electrical noise, and the ulility is designed for "not-random" ambience noise), voice effect does its job, but thats all.

The sound in my clip could sound as if it came from the speakers, but it is not, is just the sound cloned to the output (with echo probably) you can see the speakers muted in my taskbar

dsp
11-16-2012, 06:43 PM
do you have the change to try another mic ?

hingj0n
11-16-2012, 07:57 PM
Hey, lgb

This problem is fixable when using another Pci-express slot, the noise what you are hearing is interference noise from the graphics card(s) that are highly loaded (you can test it with any game) this has nothing to do with your cpu, appearantly this card is picking up noise from the PCI-e interface and you can hear that through the microphone. I had it with my previous soundcard too after I upgraded my graphics card to a 560GTX ti, your motherboard uses alot of traffic through the pci-e channel, that's what you hear.

If any other slot is availible- or position your soundcard the most far away pci-e slot from your graphic-card.

Hope you can fix it (not in my case, I can't fix it)

Igb
11-17-2012, 01:33 AM
do you have the change to try another mic ?
Of course, i tried with my old mic as i stated before, is one of the first possibilities i wanted to discard :)

Hey, lgb

This problem is fixable when using another Pci-express slot, the noise what you are hearing is interference noise from the graphics card(s) that are highly loaded (you can test it with any game) this has nothing to do with your cpu, appearantly this card is picking up noise from the PCI-e interface and you can hear that through the microphone. I had it with my previous soundcard too after I upgraded my graphics card to a 560GTX ti, your motherboard uses alot of traffic through the pci-e channel, that's what you hear.

If any other slot is availible- or position your soundcard the most far away pci-e slot from your graphic-card.

Hope you can fix it (not in my case, I can't fix it)

I'm happy to see I am not alone with my problem. Your explanation seems very probable, it explains why the noise gets worse when i heavily load my graphics cards, although it remains a mystery how the heavy CPU load almost cancels it (the traffic on that pciex port should not vary much in this case)

Im gonna test the sound card in other slot in a few moments, only thing i do not like much is that i have to use one of my gpu's @8x in that case, i hope its not a big handicap.

I am also very surprised, I expected a soundcard like this, that even takes a "clean" voltage line directly from the PSU, to not have this kind of problems.

Oh, and also tried with only one GPU (not physically disconnecting it, just using the switch for the pciex ports), and setting them at pciex 2.0 speed too, no improvements

Many Thanks for your help.

Pd. Any official confirmation is always appreciated :)

hingj0n
11-17-2012, 10:35 AM
It's a dissapointment for me to, to spend ~€200 on a soundcard and you get these weird things, especially when they take power directly from the PSU. Still better than my old soundcard which had this problem on the headphone range instead of the microphone (god that was annoying).
And maybe some other motherboards don't have this problem, when you plug it in on other ones.

I guess I'm gonna try that too in some time. But it is a problem from interference with the graphic cards on the PCI-e slots.

Igb
11-17-2012, 10:36 PM
It's a dissapointment for me to, to spend ~200 on a soundcard and you get these weird things, especially when they take power directly from the PSU. Still better than my old soundcard which had this problem on the headphone range instead of the microphone (god that was annoying).
And maybe some other motherboards don't have this problem, when you plug it in on other ones.

I guess I'm gonna try that too in some time. But it is a problem from interference with the graphic cards on the PCI-e slots.

You, sir, made my day. Many thanks.

Tried in the last pciex x16 slot, and now the noise is gone. The bad part is that one of my graphics cards is running @8x (i know is not a noticeable loss, but anyways having different bandwidths in a multigpu setup is always a possible source of stuttering)

Had some artifacts in my screen tho, but was a bad contact on the cable (got scared anyways, fixing a thing to break another xDD)

Many thanks again, and best regards.

PS. A note in the manual of the phoebus suggesting this will be really appreciated, i suggest to include it at least in future revisions, it can save lots of time to users like me not having depth knowledge about this behaviour

hingj0n
11-18-2012, 03:04 PM
You, sir, made my day. Many thanks.

Tried in the last pciex x16 slot, and now the noise is gone. The bad part is that one of my graphics cards is running @8x (i know is not a noticeable loss, but anyways having different bandwidths in a multigpu setup is always a possible source of stuttering)

Had some artifacts in my screen tho, but was a bad contact on the cable (got scared anyways, fixing a thing to break another xDD)

Many thanks again, and best regards.

PS. A note in the manual of the phoebus suggesting this will be really appreciated, i suggest to include it at least in future revisions, it can save lots of time to users like me not having depth knowledge about this behaviour

Glad I could help you :)

Hope some more people hear about this problem and ASUS actually does something about this and make a notice in manual or whatever indeed.

Happy gaming!

Igb
11-18-2012, 03:30 PM
Seems that i counted my chickens before they hatched.

The noise is gone... in idle.

And seems that what produces it is the traffic in the pciexpress bus of the second card (the one that shares bandwith tish the last slot). The noise does not appear if i run furmark with SLI disabled, that means only 1st gpu used. But... when the second card is loaded the noise is there at almost the same level...

I want to try the pciex x1 slot, but i can physically acess to it because of the heatsink of my second card :S

Any other suggestions? I am still very grateful to hingj0n for helping me to find the problem... now i am looking for a definite solution :)

Glasofruix
11-18-2012, 03:32 PM
There are pci-e cables especially made for unaccessible slots.

Igb
11-18-2012, 04:23 PM
There are pci-e cables especially made for unaccessible slots.

Many thanks, after a bit research i ordered a pcie x1->x1 flexible extender, will see how i can adapt it. In the meantime...

The best result i've got so far is with mic plugged to integrated audio card. I will try to connect the additional pciex power connector for the pciex bus (although RIVE manual states is not necessary if not pluging 4 graphics cards i hope it can bring some stability here) and to switch the sound card to the only slot i have not tried yet (the second red slot, @x8) but i think the noise in this case will come from the first GPU

Will post my findings :)

Igb
11-18-2012, 06:08 PM
Problem fixed :)

The real vast improvement was connecting the pciex power connector for the pciex bus, seems that with only 2 cards still needs that extra "juice" to supress correctly that electric noise.

In RIVE's manual it states that is only neccesary when plugging 4 graphics cards... I'd say is quite advisable in any case, specially when audio is involved, and even more with another top-tier component (of same manufacturer) showing problems otherwise.

Now i have one more time my gpu's @x16, sound card in black 8x slot, and a clean mic input (if i don't put a too high volume, upping it over 23-25db brings back the noise, but it's not a big deal as it already is loud enough)

Many Thanks, and really hope Asus takes notes of the suggestions, if it's not possible to fix the problem (seems really hard at this stage) at least noting them in both manuals will be a very good point :)

hingj0n
11-18-2012, 06:33 PM
Problem fixed :)

The real vast improvement was connecting the pciex power connector for the pciex bus, seems that with only 2 cards still needs that extra "juice" to supress correctly that electric noise.

In RIVE's manual it states that is only neccesary when plugging 4 graphics cards... I'd say is quite advisable in any case, specially when audio is involved, and even more with another top-tier component (of same manufacturer) showing problems otherwise.

Now i have one more time my gpu's @x16, sound card in black 8x slot, and a clean mic input (if i don't put a too high volume, upping it over 23-25db brings back the noise, but it's not a big deal as it already is loud enough)

Many Thanks, and really hope Asus takes notes of the suggestions, if it's not possible to fix the problem (seems really hard at this stage) at least noting them in both manuals will be a very good point :)

Audio cards are very sensitive indeed, to the smallest electrical distortions, what I get from what you are saying is that you inserted another cable into your motherboard for extra power on the PCI-e bus?

Glad your problem is gone btw ;)

Igb
11-18-2012, 07:16 PM
Audio cards are very sensitive indeed, to the smallest electrical distortions, what I get from what you are saying is that you inserted another cable into your motherboard for extra power on the PCI-e bus?

Glad your problem is gone btw ;)
Yes, that's exactly what i did. I already had the upper EPS and ATX connectors filled (for the processor), i don't know why didn't discarded this at first...

Pobably because I never thought it was neccessary with 2 graphics cards, but it seems i were wrong. Seems also quite ilogical how a "just decent" integrated sound card deals better with the unclean bus than a very good sound card with direct power from the psu (maybe because the chipset is in the middle or because of the non-shared IRQ's? I don't know, It uses a logical pcie connection after all, right?)

Truth be told, also expected it to perform better than my old SB X-fi Titanium (what it does, but not with this noise, it was unexistant with my old soundcard, but it gave me not few problems, i think now i can finally say that i made a change for the better)

hingj0n
11-19-2012, 02:40 PM
Well, glad this problem can be fixed with some people, in my instance I don't have an other slot to insert my graphics card in it, I have a crappy motherboard :S. Think I'll buy an ROG Mobo in the future dunno yet.

It's always preferrable to give the motherboard extra power when you can do that, it will give you the stablest way to deal with this "crap" even when you don't really need it. A integrated sound card does not take power/data from the PCI-e bus, but the whole PCI-e lane is powered by that chip, so, I think that that is the most explainable way for this problem.

However, I did not hear if this problem also occured on the Xonar Essence STX (pci-e). I'm curious if it is present on that card too.

Brandhor
12-17-2012, 01:41 PM
I have the same problem, I have a rampage iv extreme and I tried to connect the card to both the x1 and x16 slots at the bottom and I also connected the pcie power cable to the ez_plug port, I also noticed that it doesn't happen if I use the rog mic

M0d
12-18-2012, 03:33 PM
I have the same problem, I have a rampage iv extreme and I tried to connect the card to both the x1 and x16 slots at the bottom and I also connected the pcie power cable to the ez_plug port, I also noticed that it doesn't happen if I use the rog mic

Same problem here with Asus Sabertooth X79, Asus GTX 680 SLI and Asus Xonar Phoebus soundcard. ROG box microphone seem to cancel a lot of that interference or it is different, but it is still there with high volume. Annoying.