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View Full Version : My brand new G750JH is being outperformed by my older G73JW.



thorbeck
09-13-2013, 10:00 PM
Hello guys and gals, nice to see this forum so active as I am currently in search for some answers.

I've just spent some hours installing Windows 8.1 on my G750JH and almost all my software is installed.
Drivers from ASUS are updated and so are updates from Windows Update.

The G750GJ is clearly performing well in Windows and with other software, but I am having an issue with Guild Wars 2.

I am thinking (and hoping) that this will be fixed in future releases from NVIDIA.
This is a pretty new laptop, and running on Windows 8.1.

But as of now my G73JW performs much better with the same settings (NVIDIA Control Panel and GW2) than the G750JH.

I noticed there's a benchmark for ROG, and I checked out the 3DMark website, but the last time I ran a benchmark was when I got a dual P3 so I'm not sure what to look for or what score I should be excepting.

So I have the following questions:

Have anyone experience similar issues with Guild Wars 2?
What benchmarks should I run?
Are there any typical windows tweaks I should be aware of?
Any tips & tricks are welcome since I've had a hard time finding any information elsewhere and most posts here seem to concern other G750 models.

Thanks.

jsarver
09-13-2013, 11:32 PM
Forget the asus graphics drivers. Get them from nvidias website. Much better performing.

hmscott
09-14-2013, 01:47 AM
Forget the asus graphics drivers. Get them from nvidias website. Much better performing.

In this case rolling back to the Asus drivers - or even older Nvidia driverss - might be a good idea, check the driver versions mentioned in this support forum for GW2:

https://forum-en.guildwars2.com/forum/support/tech/Nvidia-Drivers

You will probably get better GW2 focused help on that board than here.

hmscott
09-14-2013, 01:53 AM
I noticed there's a benchmark for ROG, and I checked out the 3DMark website, but the last time I ran a benchmark was when I got a dual P3 so I'm not sure what to look for or what score I should be excepting.


That ROG RealBench benchmark is mostly CPU/IO/system related and 3d acceleration doesn't make any difference. Desktop size does, but that is about it.

Read through the G750 forums, there are lots of posts on system tuning, some using Asus GPU Tweak and Intel Extreme CPU Tuning Utility, along with benchmark results.

www.futuremark.com is where 3dmark, 3dmark11, etc are hosted.

thorbeck
09-14-2013, 01:15 PM
Thanks for the replies.
Just did a RealBench and ended up with a score of 474.

Running GPU-Z and the bus speed doesn't change during the test provided.
Reading up on the forums on GW2 this seems to be a known bottleneck, but I can't find a way alter this setting other than the power options in Windows, which are set correctly.
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hmscott
09-14-2013, 01:30 PM
thorbeck, cool!, you can post your RealBench scores here on the ROG forums:
http://rog.asus.com/forum/showthread.php?36600-ROG-RealBench-Leaderboard

thorbeck
09-14-2013, 03:18 PM
I ran the RealBench on my G73JW resulting in a score of 271 compared to 474 on my G750JH.
So that's comforting at least.

However, G750JH is running PCI-E @ x8 1.1 no matter what I do, and my G73JW is running @ x16 1.1.

Like I said earlier, I got most of drivers from the Asus site, but I'm running a beta driver from Nvidia now.

I'll try the other betas too, but should I also be looking into the chipset drivers when it comes to PCI-E?

hmscott
09-14-2013, 03:48 PM
However, G750JH is running PCI-E @ x8 1.1 no matter what I do, and my G73JW is running @ x16 1.1.


This is what I am seeing:
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Try running this, and see if it finds updates for your system. IE seems to run it best. It takes a couple of runs to install/work correctly. You need java to run it.
http://www.intel.com/p/en_US/support/detect

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Curious as to what it will make of running on an unreleased Windows 8.1 OS.

thorbeck
09-14-2013, 04:00 PM
Thanks for that info.
My chipset was up to date, but it didn't recognize my NVIDIA card.

I think I found the solution though.

Patience.

After all, I am running Windows 8.1 and there are no release drivers from Nvidia yet.

hmscott
09-14-2013, 04:11 PM
Patience.

After all, I am running Windows 8.1 and there are no release drivers from Nvidia yet.

http://blogs.nvidia.com/blog/2013/06/26/nvidia-drivers-for-windows-8-1-release-preview-now-available-2/

It looks like the 326.80 beta driver is for Windows 8.1 as well...

Weird that the PCIE setting is off...

326.98 beta, includes an international notebook version for download :)
http://www.guru3d.com/files_details/geforce_326_98_opengl_4_4_beta_driver_download.htm l

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thobeck, if this driver didn't help your PCIE situation, I would roll back to 326.80 or the Asus supported driver, as this one isn't benchmarking as fast as 326.80 for me, so I am back on 326.80

thorbeck
09-14-2013, 08:42 PM
I hear about people "reseating" their card on stationary computers when their not running on a correct PCI-E value, but that shouldn't be an issue with a laptop right?
I've disassembled an older laptop once, and the graphics card was pretty tightly coupled so I can't believe that's an issue.
Hopefully this will be fixed with a proper driver.

Thanks for your feedback.

hmscott
09-15-2013, 12:22 AM
I hear about people "reseating" their card on stationary computers when their not running on a correct PCI-E value, but that shouldn't be an issue with a laptop right?
I've disassembled an older laptop once, and the graphics card was pretty tightly coupled so I can't believe that's an issue.
Hopefully this will be fixed with a proper driver.

thorbeck, I seriously doubt you need to reseat the graphics card, and it requires so much laptop dis-assembly you will void your warranty just getting to the point you can access the card.

It's too bad you didn't see what the PCIE setting looked like while booted under the Windows 8 Asus OEM build that came on your laptop. That is why I preserve the original install for future use in case I come across something like this. You could swap in the original drive/build and double check.

IDK the disk layout for that laptop, but it is possible that the recovery partition is on the HD and not on the SSD/RAID. If you didn't blow away the partitions on the HD drive you might be able to do an Alt-F10 (at boot) recovery. It will blow away your Windows 8.1 install on the SSD/RAID, but you can always recreate Windows 8.1 on another drive and dual boot between 8.0 OEM install and 8.1 Preview release.

Asus didn't have recovery DVD's listed for sale for the G750 series on their eStore last I checked, but you could ask Asus.

You can register online for support by registering your laptop, you will need to set up an account first:
https://account.asus.com/
https://account.asus.com/product_list.aspx?lang=en-us

You can ask if they can sell you a recovery DVD for the G750JH so you can recreate an Asus OEM 8.0 install.

You can also get a 2.5" drive and put it in the other internal bay or in an external USB 3.0 case and clone the 8.1 install to it so you can preserve your work done to get 8.1 running.

Note that while you can clone the build to the disk in a USB 3.0 case, you can't boot from USB with that build. You will need to put the cloned drive in an internal bay and boot it from there. Not sure how that will work either, as it will be in a different drive bay and require BIOS changes to get to work. UEFI adds another layer of fun to the issue.

I use Macrium Reflect Free for non-commercial use to clone drives:
https://www.macrium.com

thorbeck
09-15-2013, 01:25 AM
Thing is I would have to reinstall the OS anyways.
The computer is paid for by the company I work for and I need the pro version for remoting and certain domain features not provided by the shipped os.

Dual boot is out of the question.

Again, thanks for you update on the issue.

hmscott
09-15-2013, 01:33 AM
Thing is I would have to reinstall the OS anyways.
The computer is paid for by the company I work for and I need the pro version for remoting and certain domain features not provided by the shipped os.
Dual boot is out of the question.
Again, thanks for you update on the issue.

thorbeck, you can use the OEM version Asus provides, and add the Pro features with a Windows 8 Pro Pack.

I picked up the feature card from a retail location and used the activation code on the card in the package to upgrade to Windows 8 Pro.

It looks like you can do it via online purchase through the Windows 8 OS, instructions here:

http://windows.microsoft.com/en-us/windows-8/feature-packs

You can get the Pro Pack code from newegg and save $5 :)
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16832416566

Or, get the card sent to you, if you can't get it locally.
http://www.newegg.com/Product/Product.aspx?Item=N82E16832416563

hmscott
09-15-2013, 03:53 AM
thorbeck, I haven't seen anyone else mention it, so thought I should here. The Windows 8.1 Preview Release isn't production software, and it will likely require a reinstall of Windows 8.1 Production release when it comes out.

Which means you loose all your application installs and configuration. That is why Microsoft suggests not installing on a production or daily use machine. Instead they suggest installing on a 2nd drive and dual boot, or do what I do and install it into a VM for testing.

http://answers.microsoft.com/en-us/windows/forum/windows8_1_pr-windows_install/note-testing-of-windows-81-preview-warning/1276b0ba-ba66-4d08-9d3f-156fa18916b4

thorbeck
09-15-2013, 10:31 AM
I'm not running a preview release.
Windows 8.1 was released earlier to companies with a MSDN subscription.

And regarding the preinstalled version that I wiped:
As much as I totally agree with you that it would be very interesting indeed to run GPU-Z on the shipped OS, it really should work as long as my drivers are up to date. Unless there is actually some faulty hardware.

And I've had ASUS for ages, and always done the same thing.

I'll admit I do regret jumping on the 8.1 train so early though, I'm DYING to run Guild Wars 2 properly on this rig. :p

hmscott
09-15-2013, 10:41 AM
I'm not running a preview release.
Windows 8.1 was released earlier to companies with a MSDN subscription.

And regarding the preinstalled version that I wiped:
As much as I totally agree with you that it would be very interesting indeed to run GPU-Z on the shipped OS, it really should work as long as my drivers are up to date. Unless there is actually some faulty hardware.

And I've had ASUS for ages, and always done the same thing.

I'll admit I do regret jumping on the 8.1 train so early though, I'm DYING to run Guild Wars 2 properly on this rig. :p

thorbek, thanks for making that clear.

So you were right, Patience is the key :)

hmscott
09-15-2013, 04:18 PM
thorbeck, this looks interesting:

http://www.guru3d.com/files_details/nvidia_inspector_download.html

Besides the fun overclocking stuff, there is nvidia profile tuning - click the settings icon to the right of the driver version in the main dialog.

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thorbeck
09-15-2013, 05:52 PM
App states compliance is off, so it should be running at max.
Hmmmm...
I'm reading up on some posts regarding the inf chipset drivers.
Alas, no improvement yet.

hmscott
09-15-2013, 05:59 PM
App states compliance is off, so it should be running at max.
Hmmmm...
I'm reading up on some posts regarding the inf chipset drivers.
Alas, no improvement yet.

Oddly enough mine shows off too, but is still downclocking to 1.1 - not at home to try it myself, but you could try turning it On or one of the other states in the drop down to see if it kicks it up.

thorbeck
09-16-2013, 08:50 AM
Tried all switched with no changes.
I've also tried reinstalling intel inf drivers with an -overall switch forcing them to override whatever driver is currently in used.
This changed nothing either.

I remember Vista had some issues where it would be stuck in a power state after returning from sleep.
Haven't found any posts regarding that on Windows 8.1 though.

The quest for frames per second continues...

hmscott
09-16-2013, 02:17 PM
Tried all switched with no changes...

thorbeck, here is the Nvidia Official 326.80 Beta thread, maybe you can report the problem there? I haven't read all 62 pages, but perhaps someone already has posted the problem or something similar.
https://forums.geforce.com/default/topic/573374/geforce-drivers/official-nvidia-326-80-beta-display-driver-feedback-thread-released-8-20-13-/1

Have you posted the problem on the MSDN 8.1 RTM feedback forum?

It also occurred to me that the Nvidia 326.80 driver came out on August 20th, and Windows 8.1 RTM came out September 9th which is well after the Nvidia release.

The Nvidia 326.80 driver release notes only mentions the Windows 8.1 Preview release support.

thorbeck
09-16-2013, 07:06 PM
Posted on the Nivida forums so we'll see.
The search on that sucks and couldn't be arsed to read all the posts regarding the driver.

I tested the GPU-Z on the stationary equivalent at work. Also running Windows 8.1.
Card increased the speed during the render test.
So no issues there.

hmscott
09-17-2013, 12:58 AM
I tested the GPU-Z on the stationary equivalent at work. Also running Windows 8.1.
Card increased the speed during the render test.
So no issues there.

In that case it might be worth the effort to build a 7/8.0 System on a spare drive and make sure it isn't a hardware problem on the laptop. I didn't see anyone else complaining about this being a problem with 8.1 in the searches I tried.

thorbeck
09-17-2013, 04:47 PM
Ok!

Installed Windows 8, drivers updated, still stuck on PCI Express x8 1.1.
So tomorrow I'll be shipping this laptop back...:(

hmscott
09-17-2013, 06:08 PM
Ok!

Installed Windows 8, drivers updated, still stuck on PCI Express x8 1.1.
So tomorrow I'll be shipping this laptop back...:(

I wonder what others with a JH are seeing? You might call and ask one of the vendors (where did you get yours?) to run CPU-Z and see what they see.

What does Asus say?

Anyone else out there with a JH seeing PCIE 3.0, or just 1.1?

Pierre990429
09-17-2013, 06:30 PM
http://i169.photobucket.com/albums/u229/pierre_67/pci3-16_zps2c3e51b6.png (http://s169.photobucket.com/user/pierre_67/media/pci3-16_zps2c3e51b6.png.html)

no problem here. using ASUS drivers.

thorbeck
09-17-2013, 09:23 PM
Are you running the Windows that came with the laptop Pierre?

Pierre990429
09-18-2013, 10:32 AM
Yes, Windows 8 64.
I didn't change anything, just uninstalled Asus Splendid and Power4gear (I can always re-install it, it's in c:\esupport\edriver\software - or download it from Asus),
and upgraded the Realtek drivers to 6976, to get the ROG Audiowizard. I tried the Nvidia 326.80beta but reverted to 311.83 soon after. (using a restore point)