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yizzle
12-01-2014, 01:38 AM
I'm considering purchasing the G751JT-CH71. I would like to swap out the mechanical drive for an SSD. I have read up on the forums and understand that the main bay has a PCIe m.2 connection and a SATA3 connection. I understand the m.2 is faster than the sata. I would like to order an SSD but am unsure what to look for. I am new to laptops. I would prefer to connect via the PCIe m.2. Searching Newegg and amazon, I am getting a little confused as to which ssds are compatible, especially with the PCIe m.2. I want to make sure I don't order something for a desktop. can anyone help me out? maybe you could refer me to a specific example of a product that would meet these requirements. Thanks!

D_Pain
12-01-2014, 03:10 AM
I'm currently using 2 HHDs for G751JT-CH71. I only had 1 HHD but added my old HHD into it. I personally have no issues without having an SSD, the laptop still just boots in a few seconds and I don't really think its worth a few hundred dollars just for a PCIe m.2 SSD. These days SATA3 SSDs are very cheap so if you were to buy an SSD, I would recommend an a SATA3 SSD. Enough with my thoughts, PCIe m.2 SSDs look more like RAMs
I'm not sure if it would help but the picture below is what you would try to find.
43784

A SATA3 SSD would look more like a normal HHD.
Amazon would have the format for the SSD written either on the title or the description of the product. As far as I know, SSDs in a desktop would also fit in the laptop. Just check if the SSD is a SATA3 format that it has a 2.5 inch width.

Wish it solved at least a bit of your confusion:)

PS. The bolts for the second bay where you can add an additional drive were very hard to unscrew. I wasn't able to unscrew it with a normal screwdriver so I had to eventually use a electric screwdriver...

yizzle
12-01-2014, 03:15 AM
Thanks for the input. That helped clarify some of my confusion. I searched for some of the m.2 ssds and, yeah they are a lot more expensive. I think I might go with one of the sata3 ssds that are currently on sale on newegg. so from what I understand, as long as it is a 2.5" sata3 drive, it should fit? Thanks for your help!

D_Pain
12-01-2014, 03:48 AM
Yes, as long as it is a 2.5" sata3 drive you are good to go.

Check this youtube link: http://youtu.be/akjzKO4HfQQ?t=12m31s
Its a video for G751JY but it looks the same. Just a better graphics cards, more RAM, and an PCIe m.2 SSD. The video would help you get a feeling how the G751 inner parts would look like.

hmscott
12-01-2014, 04:01 AM
Guys, it should be mentioned that an M.2 PCIE part like the Samsung XP941 will run up to 3x faster than a 2.5" SATA III drive :)

That is 1500MB/sec vs 500MB/sec.

That is a really dramatic improvement. Yes, it costs more, but it is such an improvement that will be noticeable it is worth it for me and others. IO bottlenecks are the last thing holding performance back in computers. All professional servers / storage use SSD as first level storage, and most bottleneck is there still, so faster buses are being developed to get even more speed. RAM Disk is another way to go too, copy over stuff at boot from SSD to memory and then run from there.

There is really no reason to invest in spinning silicon drives any more. Get the heat out and the speed up by moving to SSD.

Also, Asus has done 2 silly things with the disk configurations on the JT/JY.

1) The Bay is shared between an M.2 PCIE port and a SATA III port. You can only use 1 device at a time in that Bay.

2) The 2nd Bay, at least for Samsung SSD's, only connects at SATA II rate. It is still up to 300MB/sec, but it isn't 500MB/sec.

I have suggested swapping cables/connectors between the 2 Bay's, to move the SATA III port to the 2nd Bay, and swap in the SATA II port to the 1st Bay where it can go unused while using the M.2 PCIE port. But noone has reported whether this is possible yet. I will check it out when I see one in person.

So, for now the best solution is to use a 512GB M.2 PCIE SSD in Bay 1, and save $ by getting a 2nd or 3rd tier SSD in the 2nd Bay that doesn't need to be the fastest to take advantage of 300MB/sec.

BTW, several SSD makers have announced, but not shipped, 1TB M.2 PCIE SSD's.

Please post what you end up getting here :)

yizzle
12-01-2014, 05:17 PM
Thanks for the responses. That video was helpful indeed. As far as the speed difference, that was the main reason I would really like an m.2 SSD but I just don't think I can spend the extra money right now. I'm thinking maybe I will a decent SATA3 and later on get an m.2 and swap them out, placing the SATA in the second bay, even if it bottlenecks at SATA2 speeds...

vpshockwave
12-02-2014, 12:16 AM
Also, Asus has done 2 silly things with the disk configurations on the JT/JY.

1) The Bay is shared between an M.2 PCIE port and a SATA III port. You can only use 1 device at a time in that Bay.

2) The 2nd Bay, at least for Samsung SSD's, only connects at SATA II rate. It is still up to 300MB/sec, but it isn't 500MB/sec.


I just bought my G751JT and immediately bought two SATAIII SSDs to run in RAID 0. I have a similar setup in my desktop and it's inhumanely fast. However upon installing both disks and running some benchmarks I realized that I'm only getting roughly SATAIII total speed in the raid configuration (500-600 MB/s) rather than the 1 GB/s speeds I get on my desktop. If I'm reading you correctly, it's because the second bay is stuck at SATAII. That would bottleneck the raid array drastically. Does that sound right according to what you wrote? Any workarounds? Why would they make one of the bays SATA II ? Why is SATA II even in PRODUCTION anymore?

hmscott
12-02-2014, 04:53 AM
I just bought my G751JT and immediately bought two SATAIII SSDs to run in RAID 0. I have a similar setup in my desktop and it's inhumanely fast. However upon installing both disks and running some benchmarks I realized that I'm only getting roughly SATAIII total speed in the raid configuration (500-600 MB/s) rather than the 1 GB/s speeds I get on my desktop. If I'm reading you correctly, it's because the second bay is stuck at SATAII. That would bottleneck the raid array drastically. Does that sound right according to what you wrote? Any workarounds? Why would they make one of the bays SATA II ? Why is SATA II even in PRODUCTION anymore?

vpshockwave, early on there was a post by a new owner that used a Crucial M550 or M500 that said he got SATA III speed in both bays - swapped the drive and ran from it in both bays, but after that all the reports are from Samsung Evo owners and all report SATA II - another guy also set up the RAID0 and was limited by the 2nd Bay SATA II speed.

The only solution I could dream up was to use a M.2 PCIE in the first bay, and swap the cable/connector around for the SATA connection between Bay 1 / 2 to get the SATA III connection in the 2nd Bay. RAID0 would work about the same except at 1GB/sec - the SATA III port would be holding back the M.2 PCIE at that point. But at least you would have an optimal speed configuration.

A single M.2 PCIE can run up to 1600MB/sec, if you get a XP941 512GB it is about 900MB/sec-1100MB/sec, almost a RAID0 by itself.
http://www.pugetsystems.com/labs/articles/Samsung-XP941-Plextor-PX-G256-M6e-M-2-Qualification-575/
http://www.pugetsystems.com/labs/articles/Overview-of-M-2-SSDs-586/#PerformanceRange

Please come back and let us know what you worked out. :)

seagle7
12-02-2014, 09:19 AM
vpshockwave, early on there was a post by a new owner that used a Crucial M550 or M500 that said he got SATA III speed in both bays - swapped the drive and ran from it in both bays, but after that all the reports are from Samsung Evo owners and all report SATA II - another guy also set up the RAID0 and was limited by the 2nd Bay SATA II speed.

The only solution I could dream up was to use a M.2 PCIE in the first bay, and swap the cable/connector around for the SATA connection between Bay 1 / 2 to get the SATA III connection in the 2nd Bay. RAID0 would work about the same except at 1GB/sec - the SATA III port would be holding back the M.2 PCIE at that point. But at least you would have an optimal speed configuration.

A single M.2 PCIE can run up to 1600MB/sec, if you get a XP941 512GB it is about 900MB/sec-1100MB/sec, almost a RAID0 by itself.
http://www.pugetsystems.com/labs/articles/Samsung-XP941-Plextor-PX-G256-M6e-M-2-Qualification-575/
http://www.pugetsystems.com/labs/articles/Overview-of-M-2-SSDs-586/#PerformanceRange

Please come back and let us know what you worked out. :)

Yes I think that's indeed the best solution.

When I was looking for the solution with my second SATA III port, I tested HDD and the original SSD it came with (a Sandisk 128Gb )
and every single drive showed the same 3Gb/s transfert rate, so it is not limited to Samsung SSD, I tried Western Digital HDD, Seagate HDD too.

That's why it really looks like it's a port issue, or maybe a driver one like you said earlier.

andreacos92
12-02-2014, 09:33 AM
Thanks for the responses. That video was helpful indeed. As far as the speed difference, that was the main reason I would really like an m.2 SSD but I just don't think I can spend the extra money right now. I'm thinking maybe I will a decent SATA3 and later on get an m.2 and swap them out, placing the SATA in the second bay, even if it bottlenecks at SATA2 speeds...

There's only one little problem.
If you buy now a model with no M.2 SSD preinstalled, then you have not the metal bracket that hold the M.2 drive in the bay.
So you'll have to use adhesive tape or something else :)

hmscott
12-02-2014, 10:11 AM
There's only one little problem.
If you buy now a model with no M.2 SSD preinstalled, then you have not the metal bracket that hold the M.2 drive in the bay.
So you'll have to use adhesive tape or something else :)

andreacos92, if everyone that wants a bracket writes in to the Feedback Channel and files a Technical Inquiry, I think Asus will come around and offer it in their estore.

Just like the 2.5" caddies you can get there for the g750/g751, along with batteries, power adapters, keyboard/touchpad top plate, etc - those aren't up for the G751 yet either, but eventually - given historical experience, Asus will get around to it - especially if they get enough requests.

http://us.estore.asus.com/index.php?l=search_list&s[search]=g750&s[title]=Y&s[short_desc]=Y&s[full_desc]=Y&s[sku]=Y&s[match]=all&s[cid]=0

Asus didn't offer extra 2.5" caddies at first too...

It's not hard to rig up a splint and sticky tape base for the M.2 PCIE card. I wouldn't let that hold you back.

The only thing I am worried about is that there have been reports of Asus Backtracker backups from HDD not booting after restoring to M.2 PCIE SSD's. I assume they got it working because they never came back, but it would have been nice if they posted what they did. Likely a Windows 8.1 DVD boot for repair will fix the boot problem.

If you do this, and get it working, please post how to do it :)

hmscott
12-02-2014, 10:20 AM
Yes I think that's indeed the best solution.

When I was looking for the solution with my second SATA III port, I tested HDD and the original SSD it came with (a Sandisk 128Gb )
and every single drive showed the same 3Gb/s transfert rate, so it is not limited to Samsung SSD, I tried Western Digital HDD, Seagate HDD too.

That's why it really looks like it's a port issue, or maybe a driver one like you said earlier.

seagle7, I remember your post with the various tests all resulting in SATA II speed in the 2nd bay.

Did you see the one by the guy with the M550/M500 that saw 6gbps in both bays? I can't find the post now, but I know I saw it. :)

andreacos92
12-02-2014, 11:52 AM
andreacos92, if everyone that wants a bracket writes in to the Feedback Channel and files a Technical Inquiry, I think Asus will come around and offer it in their estore.

Just like the 2.5" caddies you can get there for the g750/g751, along with batteries, power adapters, keyboard/touchpad top plate, etc - those aren't up for the G751 yet either, but eventually - given historical experience, Asus will get around to it - especially if they get enough requests.

http://us.estore.asus.com/index.php?l=search_list&s[search]=g750&s[title]=Y&s[short_desc]=Y&s[full_desc]=Y&s[sku]=Y&s[match]=all&s[cid]=0

Asus didn't offer extra 2.5" caddies at first too...

It's not hard to rig up a splint and sticky tape base for the M.2 PCIE card. I wouldn't let that hold you back.

The only thing I am worried about is that there have been reports of Asus Backtracker backups from HDD not booting after restoring to M.2 PCIE SSD's. I assume they got it working because they never came back, but it would have been nice if they posted what they did. Likely a Windows 8.1 DVD boot for repair will fix the boot problem.

If you do this, and get it working, please post how to do it :)

Hi hmscott, I hope that Asus will sell them of course :)

I just remember that nowadays they aren't available. However, imho, it's not a big problem because the performance gap between Sata III and PCIe is very noticeable, even if Asus will not sell the bracket in a short time, adhesive tape and enjoy :)

vpshockwave
12-02-2014, 11:23 PM
vpshockwave, early on there was a post by a new owner that used a Crucial M550 or M500 that said he got SATA III speed in both bays - swapped the drive and ran from it in both bays, but after that all the reports are from Samsung Evo owners and all report SATA II - another guy also set up the RAID0 and was limited by the 2nd Bay SATA II speed.

The only solution I could dream up was to use a M.2 PCIE in the first bay, and swap the cable/connector around for the SATA connection between Bay 1 / 2 to get the SATA III connection in the 2nd Bay. RAID0 would work about the same except at 1GB/sec - the SATA III port would be holding back the M.2 PCIE at that point. But at least you would have an optimal speed configuration.

A single M.2 PCIE can run up to 1600MB/sec, if you get a XP941 512GB it is about 900MB/sec-1100MB/sec, almost a RAID0 by itself.
http://www.pugetsystems.com/labs/articles/Samsung-XP941-Plextor-PX-G256-M6e-M-2-Qualification-575/
http://www.pugetsystems.com/labs/articles/Overview-of-M-2-SSDs-586/#PerformanceRange

Please come back and let us know what you worked out. :)

Thanks for the response. My SSDs are Corsair Force GTs so if all of these different brands are reporting it then it must be the controller or possibly a driver, though I have my doubts about that considering it's a standard intel chipset and I've installed drivers straight from intel's web-site with no success.

The prices of the M2 SSDs aren't terrible, but I really don't feel like going through the trouble of reinstalling everything again. I even thought about returned the two SSDs and getting one larger one, that way I could use the SSD for the SATA3 port and then I could put back in the 1TB HDD for the SATA2 port, but in the end I just don't feel like messing with it. It's still much faster than it was, and that'll have to do until (possibly) there is a bios update or driver update that can rectify it.

hmscott
12-03-2014, 01:53 AM
Thanks for the response. My SSDs are Corsair Force GTs so if all of these different brands are reporting it then it must be the controller or possibly a driver, though I have my doubts about that considering it's a standard intel chipset and I've installed drivers straight from intel's web-site with no success.

The prices of the M2 SSDs aren't terrible, but I really don't feel like going through the trouble of reinstalling everything again. I even thought about returned the two SSDs and getting one larger one, that way I could use the SSD for the SATA3 port and then I could put back in the 1TB HDD for the SATA2 port, but in the end I just don't feel like messing with it. It's still much faster than it was, and that'll have to do until (possibly) there is a bios update or driver update that can rectify it.

vpshockwave, you don't need to reinstall everything, you can use a program like Macrium Reflect to clone from the install you made on the 2.5" SSD to the M.2 PCIE SSD. I haven't tried to clone with those particular specs, but from 2.5" to 2.5" over internal SATA and between USB 3.0 and internal SATA worked fine. After the cloning, remove the original disk and boot on the new clone.

Macrium Reflect Free
http://www.macrium.com/reflectfree.aspx

The HDD only transfers between 80-100MB/sec, so a 300MB/sec SSD is faster. Plus you get the HDD heat generation out of the laptop, which is a plus.

If you do give an M.2 PCIE SSD a try please come back and let us know how it worked for you :)

seagle7
12-09-2014, 08:21 AM
seagle7, I remember your post with the various tests all resulting in SATA II speed in the 2nd bay.

Did you see the one by the guy with the M550/M500 that saw 6gbps in both bays? I can't find the post now, but I know I saw it. :)

I did thank you, if I stumble upon a Crucial SSD or another brand, I will try it of course, but I have my doubts :-)

hmscott
12-09-2014, 08:42 AM
I did thank you, if I stumble upon a Crucial SSD or another brand, I will try it of course, but I have my doubts :-)

seagle7, I have my doubts too, not sure how that guy got SATA III readings in both Bay's, that's why I was asking if you saw the post, and I thought I saw your post around that time / area, so you might have seen it.

I was hoping to talk to that guy and straighten out what is going on - like look at his measurements and hardware in more detail. Maybe he got an early build.

seagle7
12-11-2014, 09:42 AM
seagle7, I have my doubts too, not sure how that guy got SATA III readings in both Bay's, that's why I was asking if you saw the post, and I thought I saw your post around that time / area, so you might have seen it.

I was hoping to talk to that guy and straighten out what is going on - like look at his measurements and hardware in more detail. Maybe he got an early build.

Yes, but it is not impossible though, manufacturers are known to modifiy elements in the hardware without notice, like the screens, the hard disks and stuff, so has you said, maybe he got an early build, or a really specific model, either way, if it's true, he got lucky.

But like I said, the laptop is just wonderfull, performance wise and the cooling is truly great, but I'm used to it with the Asus G series; best gamer laptops for me

danchamp
12-25-2014, 06:08 AM
Great post guys. So its clear that for a SATA III what the form factor should be.

I am new to laptops as well and just ordered this last night from New Egg. I intend to get an SSD when I can afford it so in a couple of months.

I am confused if there is a form factor for these m.2 SSDs, will these http://goo.gl/AqrjBK all fit easily?

It has a 1 TB old technology drive in it, so if a get an m.2 SSD I shall use it as primary and the old 1 TB as secondary. That is possible right?

Thanks,
DAN

hmscott
12-25-2014, 01:37 PM
Great post guys. So its clear that for a SATA III what the form factor should be.

I am new to laptops as well and just ordered this last night from New Egg. I intend to get an SSD when I can afford it so in a couple of months.

I am confused if there is a form factor for these m.2 SSDs, will these http://goo.gl/AqrjBK all fit easily?

It has a 1 TB old technology drive in it, so if a get an m.2 SSD I shall use it as primary and the old 1 TB as secondary. That is possible right?

Thanks,
DAN

danchamp, the Samsung XP941 512GB has been reported as one of the M.2 PCIE SSD's Asus is shipping in their G751's, so it should fit :)

You can clone the OS from the HDD to the SSD theoretically, I use Asus Backtracker and Macrium Reflect, but reports have been that they can't get the cloned M.2 PCIE to boot. I would try it and use a Windows 8.1 DVD to do a repair session on the M.2 SSD to fix boot, see if that works. Make sure the original HDD is out of the laptop when you do this.

Macrium Reflect Free
http://www.macrium.com/reflectfree.aspx

Asus Backtracker for Windows 8.1
http://support.asus.com/download.aspx?SLanguage=en&p=3&m=Backtracker&hashedid=n%2fa

Please come back and lets us know how it works out for you, and start a new thread on your experience - how you got it to work :)

Killam0n
01-02-2015, 09:59 PM
I have the G751JT-CH71 I installed an Intel (730) 480gb SSD as OS drive SATA. My WEI (windows index rating) improved (Score is: 8.1) and my Heaven Benchmark score improved ( Score 1451 Extreme Tess). The boot time is average 9.1 - 12.5 seconds (cold boot) (sometimes less) from sleep state its instant on or about 1 sec.

jinishans
06-07-2015, 03:56 AM
49682

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I too just got my GT-CH71 couple of days from costco, it doesn't have a M.2 connector. I was just wondering is it possible to still fix a M.2 ssd or it's not advisable ?

Looks like in this thread few have installed M.2 ssd in GT-CH71, I was wondering whether CH71 has M.2 connector and my laptop alone doesn't have it or as mentioned in another thread the M.2 connector was missing in some batches and some comes with the M.2 connector.