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JasenDoe
01-23-2015, 12:52 AM
Hello everyone! This is my first post!
Tho I have been stalking all of you trough the forums and posts!
A lot of thanx to HMscott and nitrox and everyone, oh God I hope I spelled that right, CBA to go check in new tab now it's late!

Anyway let's move on to the thing you are here for!
Yesterday - 22.01.2015 new drivers for nvidia just came out late at night.
A lot of stuff like 3d something, multi render something ... all that tehnical mumbo-jumbo :)

Anyway I'm using a G751 with i7 4860HQ , that is UNDERVOLTED to -75mV on both cache and offset of procesor!
( thank you to the posts about undervolting with XTU guys ! ! ! )

And I have run my daily Firestrike benchmark.

I am ussualy around 8500, but with this new drivers I'm going to 8600 and just now 8640+ , WICH IS GREAT!
But my temps on the benchmark are now around 81 degrees! And before that it was around 77-78 MAX!

Also in games with everything maxed out like farcry 4 I have temps around 87 degrees NOW and before it was 83-84 MAX !
( that is with -75 mv undervolt ).
League of legends is like never above 70 degrees...

So temps went up around +3C, but preformance also went up just a little.

I have been using the Notebook fan control ( with the profile for g751 that was uploaded THANK you very much mister <3 ! ), till today when it went APES#!T during a game,
seems that vents went down to minimum at one point but went back after few secs, that made temps go to 93 DEGREES!
( we are talking about procesor ofc ! )

So I decided to uninstall it and delete it ( it was great for a while, temps never went over 85 during regular gaming - like planetside2, warthunder etc .)
But it went mad for a second and that made me worrie, so off it goes, now its around 87 degrees again on everything maxed ( 76 degrees on GPU ).

Also since we are not using the integrated procesor graphics, could it be disabled so we can undervolt eaven more?
I have a feeling it's just making heat for nothing but we are still giving it the required amount of volts....

LONG STORY SHORT - TL;DR
MAKE MORE AGRESSIVE FAN PROFILES ASUS THAT ARE LEGIT THANK YOU!
NEW DRIVERS - MORE HEAT - LITTLE MORE PREFORMANCE! ( let's wait for DirectX 12 that will give a lot of preformance and less power consumption as they say! )

Sorry for my medicore english, peace from CROATIA!
A worried asus owner.

NitroX
01-23-2015, 10:26 AM
Hello JasenDoe! Firstly, I apologize for what happened with the NBFC profile if you used the one that I uploaded. I know that it has issues and I'm currently trying to get to the source of it and eventually make a stable profile.

As for the graphics driver, I've also noticed an increase in CPU temp while gaming after I updated to 347.09 drivers. Since then I went back to 344.75 just to continue my tests with the same drivers. The temperature increase can actually be due to performance (FPS) increase. What I've noticed is that the CPU gets hotter as the FPS increases, so if the GPU will perform better this will stress the CPU even more to be able to keep the pace with the GPU. So yea, from this point of view, it's not that strange to get increased temperatures if the FPS also went up.

The bad thing is that we keep getting updates that increase our temps and not lowering them -_- . I just played Crysis 3 yesterday with NBFC at max (3300rpm) and maximum undervolt (-90mv core , -100mv cache +34x on all cores) and the peak temperature was 88C ... I mean WHAT THE HELL!! The average was indeed around 79-80C but that peak made me worry. If with Undervolt and the fans running at max I managed to get that peak temperature then if I would use stock fan profile + stock volts the temps would get to a level where my CPU would throttle. Totally unacceptable!
I currently run the CPU at x32 on all cores when I'm gaming just to keep the temps under 80C. I am considering a repaste at the warranty service but I don't really have the time right now, and I'm also worried about letting them open my unit...

As for the integrated GPU, I don't think that it gets any power since it is disabled . The temp on the CPU GT Cores (which I presume that is the graphics chip in HWInfo) is always lower than all other CPU temps. Meaning in fact that it doesn't work and produce any heat, but being so close to the other components some heat is also transfered to it.

I have been talking to ASUS Support and they told me that they will announce the developer team about this fan problem. They told me to check the website for Bios updates . Now, we don't have much to do. Just to wait.
You could also send a technical feedback explaining the temp problem and ask for a new fan profile just to keep the pressure on the dev. team:
https://vip.asus.com/VIP2/Services/QuestionForm?lang=en-us .

Your english is more than ok ;) . Don't worry, cheer up. This is still a beast of a machine. Just that the temps aren't quite what we were expecting.

JasenDoe
01-23-2015, 11:48 AM
Thank you Nitrox for that great reply!

I would like to say that yes I was using your profile with notebook fan + bios 205, but after this update they just went mad for a short time, enough to get me worried. So I had to uninstall, I have no problems with fans being too loud, when they are on 3100 I can barely hear them.
And they never pass 3100 with stock fan option. I would like to see a fan profile for hardcore gaming, like 3300 RPM when it gets to 75C ! That would be awesome!

Anyway, I'm around 87 degrees now on CPU with this new Drivers.... my problem is that we had a performance boost of around 1.5%.

Mine 8500~ on firestrike went up to 8650 now last test today, that is boost of around 1.5% and we got +3C on CPU and at least +1-2C on GPU!

This is ridiculous ! 1.5% preformance for 3 degrees more ? ! No thank you!

I will be sticking to this NVIDIA update, because I want to test the high temperatures!
And if I have problems with temperatures/paste job on cpu I want it to burn-out so I can get a new one before warranty :)

Also I don't think us g751jy owners have a problem with bad paste job, we all have temperatures around 85-90 with hardcore gaming ( no undervolt and maxed out settings and no fan profile - high performance on battery - it could go even higher ).

Most of us have this problem, undervolting will give you 3-4 maybe eaven 5C , but that will not solve the problem.

I have noticed that with the nvidia update, it didn't just come with graphics drivers and nvidia Physx, ( I always select custom install to see what I am downloading ) , it came with some multi-something and 3d-something.... a lot of drivers that maybe us without 3d screen don't need?
I don't know...just throwing out ideas here....

When I asked if we could undervolt eaven more because we are not using the integrated graphics, I though that since we don't use it...and volts are going to the cpu like the cpu is using it ( since it doesn't know it it is using it, and it is taking all the volts it needs for normal use ).
So I though, maybe it could get killed so we could remove all the milivolts from the cpu.

But anyway, I don't think all of us got a bad paste job, since we all have temps that go around 85 while gaming for over an hour.

Thank you for the post again NitroX, and yes I will be posting and bugging the dev team to make the new fan profile MUCH more agressive.
If you want a quite laptop go buy something slim without dedicated graphics...this is a beast of a laptop and it's ROAR should be POWERFUL haha! :)

Anyway keep the updates coming! I am not liking this new temperatures ! ! !

sk3tch
01-23-2015, 01:20 PM
As long as you're not seeing throttling while gaming (key is: while gaming; NOT benchmarking) those temps are not crazy. Use something like MSI Afterburner to run a graph of temps versus GPU speed and utilization while you play - you can then see if those temps are affecting anything other than you. :)

JasenDoe
01-23-2015, 01:53 PM
As long as you're not seeing throttling while gaming (key is: while gaming; NOT benchmarking) those temps are not crazy. Use something like MSI Afterburner to run a graph of temps versus GPU speed and utilization while you play - you can then see if those temps are affecting anything other than you. :)

I am using MSI afterburner, and yes I have never went above 88C on high gaming after 3-4 hours ( 81 degrees on firestrike benchmark ), but my ambient temp is around 24 ( i'm around 1 meter away from a radiator in my room ).

But imagine, hot summer, in Croatia....a toasty lan party of Civilization for over 8 hours straight ( yes we are stupid like that )....
I think it will come to thermal throttle then, that is why we need at least an option to set fans to gaming profile, cmon the laptop is not loud at all.

When I was using the notebook fan control I have never been over 83 degrees, but sometimes the fans go lower then on stock settings, that made it burn up to 93 degrees. I hope you can make a more agressive fan profile, legit or the notebook fan control one. Now it's around 87 max with the new drivers without the fan control.

Also my core #1 seems to be 1-2C hotter then core #0, is this normal ( 4860HQ ) ?!
Core 0 - 85 degrees
Core 1 - 87 degrees

Point is : We get new drivers that use the graphics card more efficiently, and we get more FPS and more heat.
The performance is 1.5% better, but the temperature is +3C, and fans are same.
Doesn't that worrie you?

P.S. Guys what are your scores and temps with the NEW DRIVER on firestrike? And what are your temps while gaming? I just did another firestrike test 8655 and this was the first with the drivers approved from 3Dmark, all tests before with the new driver showed that drivers were not approved, now they are, temps still high tho :(

sk3tch
01-23-2015, 04:39 PM
Firestrike:

Before (NVIDIA 347.09)
8540 (http://www.3dmark.com/fs/3846155)

After (NVIDIA 347.25)
8535 (http://www.3dmark.com/3dm/5632295)

GPU maxed out at 76C. CPU at 79C.

The Firestrike results are inconsequential and can be considered "the same" if you factor in margin of error.

And no - it's not abnormal to have one core hotter than another.

JasenDoe
01-23-2015, 05:48 PM
Firestrike:

Before (NVIDIA 347.09)
8540 (http://www.3dmark.com/fs/3846155)

After (NVIDIA 347.25)
8535 (http://www.3dmark.com/3dm/5632295)

GPU maxed out at 76C. CPU at 79C.

The Firestrike results are inconsequential and can be considered "the same" if you factor in margin of error.

And no - it's not abnormal to have one core hotter than another.

I know that it is normal to have the core 0 hotter then core 1, but other way round I am not so sure, do you know?

What are your gaming temps, and are you undervolting at all?

I went from 8500 to 8650, dunno seems like an upgrade, maybe yes marginal error, but the frame rate is noticable in some parts of the firestrike test.

sk3tch
01-23-2015, 05:59 PM
I ran BF4 MP in spectator mode for over an hour. The same test that I had run previously (under 347.09). Here are the temp results...(I played it full screen - I just showed windowed mode for the purposes of the screenshot):

Before (NVIDIA 347.09)
CPU Max 90C; GPU Max 83C
http://1pcent.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/bf4_mp_1hr-300x175.jpg (http://1pcent.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/bf4_mp_1hr.jpg)
(click to enlarge)

After (NVIDIA 347.25)
CPU Max 88C; GPU Max 80C
http://1pcent.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/bf4_mp_1hr_34725-300x175.jpg (http://1pcent.com/wp-content/uploads/2015/01/bf4_mp_1hr_34725.jpg)
(click to enlarge)

EDIT: I have all of this data due to writing a review on my laptop - here (http://1pcent.com/?p=433).

Again - within margin of error for tests. I could re-run it and have numbers slightly higher or lower.

I am not undervolted. I think that undervolting/clocking components is stupid.

My temps are actually lower with the new drivers. Therefore - it's likely there is something wrong with your machine.

JasenDoe
01-23-2015, 06:32 PM
My cpu is 88-87 max , and gpu never goes over 78, that means there is nothing wrong with machine, since gpu temps are better then yours and same on both drivers, I just got 3 more degrees on CPU coz of the update, that is a bit too much to call it marginal error. Also your first picture shows cpu on 90 degrees :S Ugh, me not like :D

I want it to run around 83 degrees MAX, it should be able to do it with the fans we have, it's just that the profile is made for those who prefer gaming in ultra silent mode, so they can hear the sniper load his bullet 3km away... or something :)

sk3tch
01-23-2015, 06:49 PM
My cpu is 88-87 max , and gpu never goes over 78, that means there is nothing wrong with machine, since gpu temps are better then yours and same on both drivers, I just got 3 more degrees on CPU coz of the update, that is a bit too much to call it marginal error. Also your first picture shows cpu on 90 degrees :S Ugh, me not like :D

I want it to run around 83 degrees MAX, it should be able to do it with the fans we have, it's just that the profile is made for those who prefer gaming in ultra silent mode, so they can hear the sniper load his bullet 3km away... or something :)

You're right. I corrected my typo.

I think the only thing we can learn from your post is not to jump to conclusions. You've gone up 3 degrees? In one test? Two? Try running more. That is not a significant boost.

90 degrees is high for the CPU, but not out of bounds.

100 degrees is the TJ max for my CPU. Reference: http://ark.intel.com/products/78930/Intel-Core-i7-4710HQ-Processor-6M-Cache-up-to-3_50-GHz

It would be nice to have more fan control. That's one thing I think we can agree on.

HulkSmash
01-23-2015, 07:02 PM
I updated to 347.25 and ended up going back to 344.75. Driver 347.25 won't let me overclock (which has happened in the past with my GTX 660m, just gotta wait for nvidia to fix it).

But I do run my 970m overclock @ 135+ core, 280+ mem; and temps never go over 73C, usually see it around 67-69C. As for the CPU I do have it undervolted to like -80 and -90. Playing AC Unity (which I hear should be CPU intensive) my CPU temps never went above 80C, staying at 78C most of the time.

JasenDoe
01-23-2015, 07:05 PM
You're right. I corrected my typo.

I think the only thing we can learn from your post is not to jump to conclusions. You've gone up 3 degrees? In one test? Two? Try running more. That is not a significant boost.

90 degrees is high for the CPU, but not out of bounds.

100 degrees is the TJ max for my CPU. Reference: http://ark.intel.com/products/78930/Intel-Core-i7-4710HQ-Processor-6M-Cache-up-to-3_50-GHz

It would be nice to have more fan control. That's one thing I think we can agree on.

I run like 3-4 tests a day xD
So yeah, well try undervolting a bit, can't hurt the processor, and lowerd my temps for 3-4 degrees with -75 mV.

By having your components run on high temperatures you are reducing the life span of components, that's why it's good to keep em as cool as possible :)

JasenDoe
01-23-2015, 07:08 PM
I updated to 347.25 and ended up going back to 344.75. Driver 347.25 won't let me overclock (which has happened in the past with my GTX 660m, just gotta wait for nvidia to fix it).

But I do run my 970m overclock @ 135+ core, 280+ mem; and temps never go over 73C, usually see it around 67-69C. As for the CPU I do have it undervolted to like -80 and -90. Playing AC Unity (which I hear should be CPU intensive) my CPU temps never went above 80C, staying at 78C most of the time.

Hulk what laptop do you have with 970m and what procesor? The post said it's G751jy, I'm just wondering, wow those temps <3 ( vertical sync? - settings? )

sk3tch
01-23-2015, 07:11 PM
By having your components run on high temperatures you are reducing the life span of components, that's why it's good to keep em as cool as possible :)

I hear that. But my CPU and GPU are operating within normal parameters. If they were running at 100C - then yes, I'd be worried.

Boxis
01-23-2015, 07:33 PM
Still better than my temps :

45857
45858

JasenDoe
01-23-2015, 07:39 PM
Boxis bro, do undervolt in XTU by -75, it's stable and you will loose around 3 degrees ( going for more undervolt depends on your specific cpu build quality ) ! Also keep you laptop on a cooler pad so it had breathing space under it, every degree counts ;) )

insiZion1
01-23-2015, 09:09 PM
Jasondoe. Which cooling pad do you use for your g751?
Boxis. Do you set max fps with msi to say 80 ... this should lower temps especially on cs.
thx

NitroX
01-23-2015, 09:24 PM
Still better than my temps :

Are you kidding me ? Dude, ok.. I understand going to 90C in AC Unity (even though it is quite high) but 90C in CS:GO ?!? Think seriously to call the warranty service and get a check of the laptop because CS isn't even an intensive game for the hardware. Make some screenshoots and/or videos while you are gaming and reaching those temps and show them to the service guys. Or just RMA it if you still can.

PS: Are you sure you didn't forgot any stress test running in background ? Like Prime95 ?

@Hulksmash: I would kill to get the temps you've got my friend... You are one lucky boy. Btw, thanks for the heads-up about the overclocking. I will stay on 344.75 until Nvidia releases a driver that enables OC.

@JasenDoe: If you want, you could download this new NBFC profile which is 95% stable. It still randomly hits "Enter" key and it gets annoying when you are watching a movie because once or twice an hour your window gets minimized... But otherwise I didn't experience any problems with this profile. https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B93LgJfweryfN3BRdExTYVBuYkE/view?usp=sharing . I recommend running the games with a On-Screen monitor like that from MSI Afterburner just to keep an eye on the temps and see if the fans fail anymore.
I recommend a clean install of the program and after you import the profile do a system restart to let the fans adjust themselves.

JasenDoe
01-23-2015, 10:24 PM
Jasondoe. Which cooling pad do you use for your g751?
Boxis. Do you set max fps with msi to say 80 ... this should lower temps especially on cs.
thx

Any cooling pad will do, because you just want something with holes to put your laptop on, so it has room to breath and is elivated, the fans on the cooling pad will do almost nothing since there are just a few holes under the laptop and the fan and quality of the cooling pad won't do much.
Any will do. ( any that is for 17-19 inch laptop )

Nitrox I have been using that profile ofc, clean install, everything worked fine for a few days temps like 82-83 MAX on gaming few hours, but now I'm back to default settings on 87-88 degrees. Because it just got some hickup when it was in a game and made the cpu go to 93 :S

Also, sometimes my ping goes from like 40 to 150-200 for no reason, no one is downloading, torrenting, or anything, belive me...and don't give me the malware and stuff questions because I'm very good at computres.

I have tried the following
- Disable save power on wifi device ( helped a bit, but still sometimes - maybe placebo ).
-Setting roaming agressivness to 1: Weak

Also disabled file sync of one drive, and all updates ofc.

You can find the settings when you right click on your wifi device and then advanced properties ( ah you will find it, I don't wanna check in details now, but it's there ).

I had ping spike every like 2 minutes, then I downloaded the net framework for windows 8.1 the newest one ( came out like a week ago - 4.5.2 i think, or something, just update the windows and take the recomended stuff also ), then it made the ping spikes go away from 2 minutes to every 5-8 minutes.
Yes I have tried pinging www.google.com -t with CMD and it also gets a spike, not only in games.

As for the CS-GO temperatures, I have seen some multiplayer games that just eat the cpu, I guess that is one of them, they go over 200 FPS on high graphics and eat the cpu alive xD

Boxis
01-23-2015, 10:47 PM
@insiZion1 - Yes, normally I use fps_max 200 in CS and the CPU is hovering at 75-79C after that, or using nvidia inspector to set lower framerate like in far cry or assasins creed,and setting lower AA afterwards or details. But still, this shouldn't be done in this laptop at all in my opinion, this is more like workaround for 400 laptops.

@JasenDoe - I have basic coolermaster pad but it doesn't seem to help that much :D

@NitroX - Yes, I will RMA it next week most likely, because I am away now, hopefully they will take it when I show them screenshots like these or so.
Should be easier for them If i compare them to these guys for example:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MZN1VDgSR-Q&list=LLZ_x9m9WZj259KwZgZV5dTw&index=2
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fTeAgr_CFWs&list=LLZ_x9m9WZj259KwZgZV5dTw&index=1
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3zmbAoTCgks

Guy has 74C in Far Cry, when I am throttling at 94-95C already, second one doesn't even hit 70C in AC4 when I am hitting 90C (having 85C most of the times), and third guy got insane temps in every game. So ye, I hope they would be able to help me somehow with this issue.

JasenDoe
01-23-2015, 11:11 PM
@insiZion1 - Yes, normally I use fps_max 200 in CS and the CPU is hovering at 75-79C after that, or using nvidia inspector to set lower framerate like in far cry or assasins creed,and setting lower AA afterwards or details. But still, this shouldn't be done in this laptop at all in my opinion, this is more like workaround for 400€ laptops.

@JasenDoe - I have basic coolermaster pad but it doesn't seem to help that much :D

@NitroX - Yes, I will RMA it next week most likely, because I am away now, hopefully they will take it when I show them screenshots like these or so.
Should be easier for them If i compare them to these guys for example:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MZN1VDgSR-Q&list=LLZ_x9m9WZj259KwZgZV5dTw&index=2
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=fTeAgr_CFWs&list=LLZ_x9m9WZj259KwZgZV5dTw&index=1
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3zmbAoTCgks

Guy has 74C in Far Cry, when I am throttling at 94-95C already, second one doesn't even hit 70C in AC4 when I am hitting 90C (having 85C most of the times), and third guy got insane temps in every game. So ye, I hope they would be able to help me somehow with this issue.

How are those temperatures possible? Are they playing in a freezer?
Or they live in sweden and play outside with gloves?

How can he go ultra in far cry 4 with 75 degrees?
And AC4 on 74? How is that possible?

I have seen the gameplay, yes it's only around 10 minutes long, after like 1-2 hours they would get to 80, but still that is a big difference.

Notice they have i7 4710HQ, I have 4860HQ, but 10-15 degrees between us is stupid !