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Clintlgm
11-29-2015, 11:38 PM
Ok it looks like we have found a real issue with changing out these OEM SSD in the G752's . My question to all of you owners.

From the factory OEM what is the SSD. Is it AHCI or NVMe and what is the setting in your BIOSs AHCI Or NVMe or Raid?

All Advertising for all G752 is that NVMe is standard? is this not so?

golomb13
11-30-2015, 07:42 AM
Ok it looks like we have found a real issue with changing out these OEM SSD in the G752's . My question to all of you owners.

From the factory OEM what is the SSD. Is it AHCI or NVMe and what is the setting in your BIOSs AHCI Or NVMe or Raid?

All Advertising for all G752 is that NVMe is standard? is this not so?

Good question, bumping it up, found in one review that disk there was:

Samsung PM951 NVMe MZVLV128

http://www.notebookcheck.net/Asus-ROG-G752VT-Notebook-Review.153805.0.html

That is slow version of SM951 but full NVMe

travo5200
11-30-2015, 03:44 PM
I have become quite vocal about this issue since receiving my G752 last week. My bios is stuck in "RAID" mode and does not allow any other modes such as "ACHI" which I believe is needed to get this drive to work properly. I can see it in disk manager and can even format it and assign it a drive path but it just will not be used as a main drive and Windows 10 installer will not recognize it. BTW, I have a SM951 AHCI ssd pci-e.

Clintlgm
11-30-2015, 07:16 PM
Yes but what was the OEM SSD?

My point is if these are coming as advertised and NVMe then MVMe M.2 SSD should work no problem. You should not need to do anything other than Clone directly to the new NVMe? If you choose something else then there could be issues.

So Far it looks like no one has any idea what there new notebook came with or how there BIOS/UEFI is set up from the factory?

This technology is pretty new and we need to have some base lines from where we start from. I have never heard of a Hard Drive swap eliminating you from tech support? after all they do claim upgradeable hard drives and RAM.

travo5200
11-30-2015, 10:21 PM
I am just going to return this laptop and the ssd. This is too much BS for an $1800 laptop. It shouldn't require any tough configuration to install. If I put in a SATA ssd in the 2.5" slot, it recognizes it immediately. This is just too ridiculous to deal with.

Clintlgm
11-30-2015, 11:18 PM
http://rog.asus.com/forum/showthread.php?78500-G752VY-RH71-replacing-default-PCIE-SSD-Question&p=555690#post555690 this is solved in this thread

Clintlgm
11-30-2015, 11:58 PM
Everything I can find says that NVMe runs in RAID mode this is what I am trying to verify.
Xploited Titan has found the solution I think what he did that, the rest are not trying is to Initialize the SSD in window that made his 950 Pro visible. While he Cloned. I think the Initializing is what everyone is missing?

Xploited Titan
12-01-2015, 05:44 AM
I have been searching bit more, and I think there is a problem with the Asus BIOS like many suspect.
Being stuck in RAID mode blocks many things it seems.

Samsung nVME driver doesn't install, because it doesn't find nVME hardware.
Samsung Magician cannot work because it cannot access the SSD fully.

I have the drive working, it's faster than the standard one, but it's still underperforming due those limitations.

Benchmark ran with Samsung Magician, I had lowish 540 MB/s numbers.

Once Asus gives us a complete unlocked BIOS (reason why we have a BIOS instead of UEFI on a laptop in 2015 is beyond my comprehension), we will be able to use the full potential, me thinks.

jaydee79
12-02-2015, 03:53 PM
I agree with you 100% Xploited Titan, I have tritten to their customer service a few time and files a complaint. I genuinely just want to have the hardware at its potential, not half right.

I struggle to understand how ASUS has all the fancy speeds they advertise when its clear their bios cannot be set in order for those to be true.


I have been searching bit more, and I think there is a problem with the Asus BIOS like many suspect.
Being stuck in RAID mode blocks many things it seems.

Samsung nVME driver doesn't install, because it doesn't find nVME hardware.
Samsung Magician cannot work because it cannot access the SSD fully.

I have the drive working, it's faster than the standard one, but it's still underperforming due those limitations.

Benchmark ran with Samsung Magician, I had lowish 540 MB/s numbers.

Once Asus gives us a complete unlocked BIOS (reason why we have a BIOS instead of UEFI on a laptop in 2015 is beyond my comprehension), we will be able to use the full potential, me thinks.

Clintlgm
12-02-2015, 07:00 PM
I have this to say, NVMe runs in RAID mode, everything I can find on the internet say's that NVMe runs in RAID Mode? On my Z97 Pro Motherboard the M.2 NVMe slot is suppose to be set for RAID if I install?
I ran a thread just for the purpose of finding out how the BIOS/UEFI is set up from the factory I haven't seen anyone respond that there's was set to anything except RAID
There is a reason that Asus keeps the BIOS/UEFI small. It would not be safe for the notebook if all the options were available like they are for motherboard. And they warranty so they can't afford for you to modify the fan profile and smoking your GPU or CPU. As you can see by the post here many people have purchased these notebooks that can't figure out even how to install an OS. So if you were covering the warranty would you want that level user able to modify Fan Profiles? or do serious overclocking of the GPU or CPU?

If enough people send back notebooks due to them not being able to install a Not so simple NVMe hard drive they will come up with the UEFI/BIOS update fairly quickly. In the mean time we found out yesterday from one of he users that two of Samsung's NVMe SSD are tested and approved SAMSUNG/MZVPV256HDGL-00000 and SAMSUNG/MZVPV512HDGL-00000 Both of these are available on Amazon. Your computers are all brand new so Cloning your 128GB to one of these should be no problem using Macrium Reflect Free (http://www.macrium.com/reflectfree.aspx)or others I am only fully confident in MR all others have had issues with UEFI Surly they have solved those issue???? MR hasn't had any issues since 2012.

sumnone
02-05-2016, 08:42 PM
Just saw this thread while looking for something else and thought I'd add some notes...

My G752VY-RH71 came with a Samsung PM951 NVMe MZVLV128.

I can't look at the BIOS right now as I'm doing some backtesting and it won't finish for another day or two (unless there's a tool I'm not aware of that allows me to see the BIOS settings through Windows?).

I just updated the BIOS last week. However, the BIOS auto-updater tool did not find the latest version of the BIOS (208). Mine came with version 206 and had a different time stamp than the one posted on the asus support site. So, I just downloaded the 208 version manually and it updated fine that way. I also updated the video bios without issue.

When I got my laptop, the 1TB sata D drive was formatted in FAT32 and had an extracted iso file on there entitiled TOOL_NB64_W10GPT_V1.0.1 (nothing in google for that) and appears to be some sort of imaging boot manager tool that they forgot to delete. It seems a little small (~500MB) to actually have the Windows 10 files, but might help some of you get Windows 10 installed? I saved it somewhere before reformatting the drive to NTFS. (I'm trying upload a pic that shows the files, but it keeps showing "invalid file" for my 14KB png file which is working fine on my computer.)

Generally, I love this laptop. However, it's got some issues that I can't decide are the laptop or Windows 10's fault. Anyway, it's nothing major, just some annoyances that I can live with and hope they iron out at some point.

JustinThyme
02-05-2016, 09:54 PM
Seeing how this was ressurected Ill go ahead and put my results
Fresh out of the box G752VY DH72 256GB NVMe drive and every other drive is connected to the IRST raid controller.Change drives, they are still connected to the IRST raid controller. You cannot select anything else. AHCI is not an option.

55379

55380

55381

Sprayingmango
02-06-2016, 12:27 AM
I just returned my G752VT and swapped it for a G752VY today at Microcenter. The M.2 SSD Asus puts in the stock VY is an absolute joke! How can they pair such a crap M.2 drive in this "enthusiast" machine???? It's performance is laughable.

JustinThyme
02-06-2016, 12:49 AM
I just returned my G752VT and swapped it for a G752VY today at Microcenter. The M.2 SSD Asus puts in the stock VY is an absolute joke! How can they pair such a crap M.2 drive in this "enthusiast" machine???? It's performance is laughable.

Which one did you get? If you got the economy model RH71 with the 128GB PM951SSD yes it is a joke and horrible. I found the SM951 256gb to bench not much under the 950 pro 512GB. I posted the crystalmark in one of the SSD threads.

Sprayingmango
02-06-2016, 01:07 AM
Yeah I guess the "$2000" is the "economy" model. SMH

JustinThyme
02-06-2016, 01:34 AM
Well, out of the G752VY models, the RH71 is the economy model. 2x8GB sticks of ram thats going to limit you to 32GB max unless you pull it apart and put 16 GB sticks where the stock ones are. The 128GB SSD that is not any better than a SATA SSD and you get a DVD player instead of blueray. The optical drive doesnt really matter if you dont use it. The SSD and RAM do.
Price is all about when and where you get it. $1999 is full MSRP on the RH71. If you keep an eye out you can do much better. I picked up the DH72 for the same price at Costco and got a 2 year warranty included with that.

Sprayingmango
02-06-2016, 01:41 AM
Well, out of the G752VY models, the RH71 is the economy model. 2x8GB sticks of ram thats going to limit you to 32GB max unless you pull it apart and put 16 GB sticks where the stock ones are. The 128GB SSD that is not any better than a SATA SSD and you get a DVD player instead of blueray. The optical drive doesnt really matter if you dont use it. The SSD and RAM do.
Price is all about when and where you get it. $1999 is full MSRP on the RH71. If you keep an eye out you can do much better. I picked up the DH72 for the same price at Costco and got a 2 year warranty included with that.

I see your point. The DVD/Bluray drive is a moot point for me since I dont use them anyway. Nobody needs more than 16GB ram, makes no performance difference there. I just wish they could have put a full SM951 instead of the slower model in it.

JustinThyme
02-06-2016, 10:49 AM
Well everyone has their performance needs. For you the Bluray isn't desirable, for me I use it often in my RV plugging the laptop up to the HDMI of the widescreen TV there. To say nobody needs more than 16GB of RAM is a bit one sided on the view point. If that's all you need then that's great for you. I do need more and use more. For anyone that does and compiling of anything more ram exponentially decreases compilation time. When I do video editing and compilation 32 GB cuts my time nearly in half of 16GB and same with code and photo batch process. So again that's a matter of choice. Honestly if they had a model in the states with 8GB of RAM and no SSD for substantially less I would have jumped on that as I can always get better performing aftermarket memory and always remove the original drives and put them away. 128GB is far too minuscule for most users. Just load GTAV on that drive and that's more than half of it used with one app. My current software installations actually push the limits of a 256GB drive so I installed a 512GB 950 pro.

Sometimes we just have to choose the model closest to our needs and budget from whats available. Microcenter near me doesn't even carry the the DH72 for whatever reason but I did note they have the DH78K on sale for $200 off msrp. Having bought your VT model from them you were a bit locked into what they have for an exchange.

flight_guy747
02-06-2016, 01:23 PM
Does anyone know, if we can expect a Bios for the G752VY, which will allow us to enable AHCI for fully use of 950 Pro with Samsung
drivers and Magician? Like the one already released for G752VT.

I have the VY and use two 950 Pro plus one 850 Pro. I also contacted Samsung about the issues and they claim, Magician
should be able to correctly see the drives (which it does not; claims all three to be 850 Pros). So that seems to be a bug.
They promised to come back to me on the issue next week.

THX!

Sprayingmango
02-06-2016, 07:02 PM
Does anyone know, if we can expect a Bios for the G752VY, which will allow us to enable AHCI for fully use of 950 Pro with Samsung
drivers and Magician? Like the one already released for G752VT.

I have the VY and use two 950 Pro plus one 850 Pro. I also contacted Samsung about the issues and they claim, Magician
should be able to correctly see the drives (which it does not; claims all three to be 850 Pros). So that seems to be a bug.
They promised to come back to me on the issue next week.

THX!

I don't know man but I hope it's soon. It's kind of rediculous that the G752VT has a new BIOS that does allow AHCI yet the VY does not. I emailed ASUS Support asking them the same thing. I think we should blast their social media/email support and make some noise so we get a solution.

I'll e-mail the PCPER guys too, these issues are ridiculous for a $2,000+ "high end" gaming machine.

JustinThyme
02-06-2016, 09:33 PM
For all those who think these machines are ridiculous please return them and buy a Dell or MSI so you can post on their support forums of how much they suck.

Samsung drives shipped in these machines, ask Samsung for support on those and see what response you get.

The only thing you can do with magician that you can't through other means is update the firmware in the 2.5 inch drives, all other functions can be done by making the setting in Windows yourself. The M2 PCIe on these machines do not support AHCI drives as that's now old technology, they are NVMe. The 2.5 inch bay fully supports AHCI and is using AHCI by default. Just because Samsun Magician doesn't see it doesn't mean it isn't so. Look with other means, it's there. Samsung Rapid mode is over rated. It uses a portion of RAM as a buffer. It will show very short peaks on performance l, that's why the Samsung performance test uses short read and write blocks, to make it look better. For a short burst it peaks then as soon as the ram it uses (which BTW is now locked in for that purpose only and cannot be used by anything else) is saturated it takes a nose dive straight into the toilet then recovers to the same speed as not using it at all. Test it with long blocks, the proof is in the pudding. Bottom line my preference, even on previous machines where it's fully functional, has been to leave it off as it uses more resources running in the background than any benefit it can provide. I'm just not one to have processes running that give me no benefit. If anyone can show me any benefits I may reconsider, however since its release I installed it once, saw no benefit, uninstalled it. I installed it on this platform just for testing to see what others are seeing and uninstalled it.

Keep in mind that this is new technology, and evolving. The VT was released well before the VY. I'm sure BIOS updates will be released eventually but I would rather be patient and wait for something that's fully developed than to get something that's half baked. I've been at this for a very long time, as in when the PC first hit the market and a Laptop was a laughable concept that could never work. Things have come a long way since then but one thing I've learned if nothing else. No cutting edge technology is perfect the minute it hits the shelves. Things are rushed to market before they are truly ready driven by the hunger of people who have to have it NOW! Then those same people will be the first to complain that it's not ready. Want to see another fine example, read the thread about people complaining about the first G751s that rolled out without Gsync then the whining about how they have to have it followed by more whining when ASUS backtracked on old technology to offer an upgrade to get it now they think it should be free.

Me, I like the challenge of new technology both on testing what others have devised and creating new things (I'm an electronics engineer by profession in the critical power industry)

flight_guy747
02-07-2016, 02:26 PM
Hello!

I am well aware this is new technology and willing to let it evolve.

I asked Samsung first before I got to this forum. They told me their drivers and Magician are OK. I shall contact ASUS and Microsoft on
that behalf. I told them that THEIR software was not working and not ASUS' or Microsofts and that they should fix it.

It was not until deeper research that I found out, that on the G752VY the 950s are being queried by a RAID driver and that
SAMSUNGs drivers and Magician require AHCI, this meaning, SAMSUNG support was correct in directing me to ASUS. On my
machine, the SATA drives are RAID as well and I can not change that in the BIOS or anywhere else. Maybe I get something wrong
here, but how are yours AHCI? I do not even have an AHCI driver listed in the Windows Control Panel, just RAID.

I am not sure I will get benefits, but at the VT threads, people have posted they got much better speed after being able to install the
SAMSUNG 950 drivers vs default Intel drivers. I want at least to be able to test first and then decide. I am not willing to give away
potential speed, which is considerable, just because a BIOS won't let me change a setting. I fully agree SAMSUNG should develop
RAID drivers for the 950 Pro as well, if that is state of the art. I just wonder, why they did not do so far, if that really is what they
will support in the future.

I just did benchmarks using the default drivers and do not come even near official speeds. (pics below) So something is happening here and
I really want to the bottom of it. Any help appreciated!

THX!

JustinThyme
02-07-2016, 02:50 PM
Please use crystamarks, AS SSD has bugs and is not reliable. We have had several thinking their performance was lacking due to this.

Two things to keep in mind. Samsung Magician and drivers are consumer based, not OEM. Samsung should design their software and drivers around the hardware, not the the hardware designers around samsungs software. You are correct in that Samsung software and drivers cannot see past the raid controller to the drives, this is where the problem lies. It is not at all uncommon in the industry for finger pointing to go on. Fact of the matter remains is these drives work fine without Samsung consumer software or drivers. Here is my 950 pro and 850 EVO run this morning on G752VY DH72 without any samsung software of drivers.

You can download crystalmark here. http://crystalmark.info/download/index-e.html

55433


55434

flight_guy747
02-07-2016, 05:08 PM
Thank you. Yes you are right, I even get slightly faster writing speeds using Crystalmark. And of course software should
follow hardware ... THX!

Clintlgm
02-07-2016, 09:08 PM
Well now we know why its taken them so long to put this series out. They have been dealing with the NVME thing for awhile now so let hope they put out a good one when they do.

Xploited Titan
05-17-2016, 05:37 AM
Finally found, no thanks to some google searching, a solution for the Samsung drivers!

Consolidated the info I have in following topic: https://rog.asus.com/forum/showthread.php?85255-G752-and-Samsung-950-Pro-Finally-got-it-all-working-like-it-should!&p=591808#post591808

JustinThyme
05-18-2016, 02:15 AM
Finally found, no thanks to some google searching, a solution for the Samsung drivers!

Consolidated the info I have in following topic: https://rog.asus.com/forum/showthread.php?85255-G752-and-Samsung-950-Pro-Finally-got-it-all-working-like-it-should!&p=591808#post591808

You dont need to go through all of that. Simply choose the right sata mode in the BIOS


They are in NVMe AHCI is not present on the M2 Slots. NVMe only, never the twain shall meet. The BIOS is confusing and the description is inaccurate. It should not be labeled AHCI/RAID. It should be RAID enabled/disabled.
The SATA III 2.5" bay is AHCI.

The windows NVMe driver is active in the out of box configuration and Its been proven time and again you gain no performance using the Samsung NVMe drivers that are only avalabe for aftermarket drives, wont work on the OEM drives.
The Samsung software cannot see past a RAID controller, this has been prevalent on all platforms since the 840 EVO drive. As soon as you disable the RAID it can see both AHCI and NVMe controllers.

If you dig through the Threads about the Specifially BIOS 211 you will see there is no difference in performance between the windows and Samsung drivers.

https://rog.asus.com/forum/showthread.php?83061-G752VY-BIOS-211-released-with-AHCI-and-RAID-0&highlight=G752VY+BIOS

Post up your crystal marks bench.