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Chargero
11-01-2016, 11:54 PM
Hello everyone.
Not long ago i updated my notebook for Windows 10. Then after some time i started having problems with CPU...
Just in like 5-10 mins after turnng my notebok on and doing whatever i do (browser/gaming/anything) my CPU clocks suddenly drop to 798... The only chance to get them up a bit is unplug the charger and plug it back (i also can reboot the system and it will go back to normal for 5-10mins. So i guess charger is not a problem). But even after that my CPU is not runnin at 100% (according to games FPS experience).
Checked everything - updated drivers that i could update, updated BIOS and so on. Also checked my energy modes (everything is maxed out), checked every solution for windows 19 (like turning off xbox live features), tried to cleaninstall windows 10, tried whatever i could but nothing.
So here is what i have:
1) random event in the log about *The speed of processor ** in group ** is being limited by system firmware. The processor has been in this reduced performance state for ** seconds*. Nothing unusual before this and nothing unusual after....
2) asus live update and any system driver update features show that there are no new drivers. But in asus support i was suggested to block some updates using some tool from Microsoft website (wushowhide.diagcab) and it shows some updates that i can hide, like HM87 LPC controller (whatever it is) and some other strange drivers. Tried to search them and couldnt find anything
3) sometimes had events like (BITS) changed from auto to manual, and vice versa. Dunno if it affects something
4) cpu fan is on 2300 like 100% of time. Dont remember if it is max fan speed (the reason i ask this is that in demanding apps my CPU is getting preety hot. up to 90-95. Didnt notice it before. Espetially having in mind that GPU is at normal temps.
Thanks all for future help. At least tell me i am not alone and what kind of problem can it be :D.
P.S. Now it seems like just some software problem, cause CPU/GPU pass all stress-tests like charm (ye the strange thing is that such random drops are really random. CPU can work perfectly during stress test, and drop while you are just browsing easy site). At first it reminded me of drops on my old MSI notebook when you plug out the charger. But as i said - everything is maxed out.
P.S.S. talking about the situation after unplugging/plugging back in - according to HWmonitor clocks go back to ~3400, but utilisation is not exceeding 30-40% while before drop it was 90-100% for 90% of time

JustinThyme
11-02-2016, 03:12 PM
The clocks are supposed to drop. This is completely normal. It reduces power consumption and heat. If you want to run it at 100% just go into power profile and set the min cpu state to 100%.

Chargero
11-02-2016, 06:43 PM
The clocks are supposed to drop. This is completely normal. It reduces power consumption and heat. If you want to run it at 100% just go into power profile and set the min cpu state to 100%.

I dont argue with that. it is normal. But i think it is not normal to drop it to 700-1000. Fps goes down to 7-10, that is completely not normal. Espetially considering the fact that it was not like that before.

unclewebb
11-03-2016, 03:20 AM
Give ThrottleStop 8.30 a try. Clear the BD PROCHOT box and see what happens to the CPU speed and FPS.

https://www.techpowerup.com/downloads/2815/throttlestop-8-30

Chargero
11-03-2016, 05:01 PM
Give ThrottleStop 8.30 a try. Clear the BD PROCHOT box and see what happens to the CPU speed and FPS.

https://www.techpowerup.com/downloads/2815/throttlestop-8-30

Nothing happens). Tried every box there - still the same. The only thing i could achieve is that there is nothing in log when clocks drop. But clocks still drop to 798.
Also, if i start notebook from battery the situation is the same - drop in like 10 min. And if i plug it in - also nothing. So i need exactly UNplug it. Only when i UNplug it the clocks go back to 3400.

unclewebb
11-03-2016, 08:18 PM
Can you post a screenshot of how you have ThrottleStop setup? Turn on the Log File option so you have a record of your CPU's performance. If it is dropping to 798 MHz while you are playing, that is going to show up in the log file. You can copy and paste the log file data to www.pastebin.com so I can have a look. When you are finished testing, exit ThrottleStop so it can save all of the log file data to a file in the Logs directory.

Chargero
11-03-2016, 11:46 PM
Can you post a screenshot of how you have ThrottleStop setup? Turn on the Log File option so you have a record of your CPU's performance. If it is dropping to 798 MHz while you are playing, that is going to show up in the log file. You can copy and paste the log file data to www.pastebin.com so I can have a look. When you are finished testing, exit ThrottleStop so it can save all of the log file data to a file in the Logs directory.

So here it is. http://pastebin.com/qZPjR6yt
The drop is at 02.27.27. Strange is that there are no changes in the log file....
So i post also
1) system logs. It gave me this (x8 for every core)
- <System>
<Provider Name="Microsoft-Windows-Kernel-Processor-Power" Guid="{0F67E49F-FE51-4E9F-B490-6F2948CC6027}" />
<EventID>37</EventID>
<Version>0</Version>
<Level>3</Level>
<Task>7</Task>
<Opcode>0</Opcode>
<Keywords>0x8000000000000000</Keywords>
<TimeCreated SystemTime="2016-11-03T23:27:27.754597000Z" />
<EventRecordID>5271</EventRecordID>
<Correlation />
<Execution ProcessID="4" ThreadID="244" />
2) screens of HWmonitor during the drop and after i unplug-plug back the charger.

unclewebb
11-04-2016, 01:52 AM
The Windows log you posted shows a time of 23:27:27. That is 11:27:27 PM. The ThrottleStop log file you posted is from 2:16 AM to 2:35 AM. This time is completely different than the Windows messages that you posted.

The ThrottleStop log does show the kind of throttling that you are talking about.



2016-11-04 02:32:09 8.00 52.2 100.0 100.0 0 63 0.6569 8.2
2016-11-04 02:32:10 8.00 61.9 100.0 100.0 0 64 0.6569 8.6
2016-11-04 02:32:11 8.00 48.8 100.0 100.0 0 62 0.6561 8.0
2016-11-04 02:32:12 8.00 40.1 100.0 100.0 0 62 0.6569 7.7
2016-11-04 02:32:13 8.00 54.7 100.0 100.0 0 62 0.6527 8.3
2016-11-04 02:32:14 8.00 39.3 100.0 100.0 0 62 0.6576 7.8
2016-11-04 02:32:15 8.00 50.6 100.0 100.0 0 63 0.6561 8.1
2016-11-04 02:32:16 8.00 43.1 100.0 100.0 0 62 0.6561 7.7
2016-11-04 02:32:17 8.00 40.6 100.0 100.0 0 61 0.6569 7.6
2016-11-04 02:32:18 8.00 67.0 100.0 100.0 0 63 0.6561 8.7

The 8.00 is the multiplier and the number beside that is the load. This means your CPU has throttled down to the minimum multiplier. The temperatures are OK so with this kind of load, there is definitely a problem here.

I am still waiting to see a picture of how you have ThrottleStop setup. Also run the Limit Reasons program built into ThrottleStop and post a picture of that while your CPU is throttling. It will probably show what is causing this throttling problem.

Chargero
11-04-2016, 12:55 PM
The Windows log you posted shows a time of 23:27:27. That is 11:27:27 PM. The ThrottleStop log file you posted is from 2:16 AM to 2:35 AM. This time is completely different than the Windows messages that you posted.

I am still waiting to see a picture of how you have ThrottleStop setup. Also run the Limit Reasons program built into ThrottleStop and post a picture of that while your CPU is throttling. It will probably show what is causing this throttling problem.

Talking about time, it is just system time and local time difference. You can see it on the screenshot.
Sorry, forgot to attach throttlestop setup. And still i double-checked the thing with logs and it seems like system logs are more often than not random. They can appear later, or not appear at all. And throttle logs clearly show throttling. I also attach Limit reasons (whatever it means :D)
Thx for trying to help.

unclewebb
11-04-2016, 08:29 PM
I did some searching last night and found another G751JY owner with the exact same problem.

https://rog.asus.com/forum/showthread.php?58588-G751JY-yes-sitting-at-800-MHZ-amp-frustrated

As soon as he used ThrottleStop to disable BD PROCHOT, his CPU immediately started running at full speed. Based on your testing so far, I think your laptop has the same problem.

Your ThrottleStop screenshot does not show any signs of throttling. Your CPU is running at 3400+ MHz like it should be. Try to get a screenshot of ThrottleStop with the Limit Reasons window open when your CPU is throttling and stuck at 798 MHz.

Limit Reasons shows what part of the CPU is causing the throttling. If a box lights up in red, that is the reason for the throttling that is presently happening. A yellow box means that some throttling was previously recorded but the CPU is not presently throttling due to that reason. After you boot up, open Limit Reasons and click on the headings, CORE, GPU and RING. This clears the previous throttling reasons so the yellow boxes should turn black. Some of these get set during the boot up phase. That is not important so you want to clear those boxes before you start testing. Also open up the ThrottleStop - Options window and check off, Add Limit Reasons to Log File. The log file will then contain throttling reasons so this data can be directly compared to the CPU multiplier.

When monitoring, run ThrottleStop by itself. Other monitoring programs like HWiNFO automatically delete the Limit Reasons data that is stored within the processor. If the Windows system logs are random or not 100% reliable then ignore this data. It was nice that Windows told you that there is a problem but now you need to fix it. Windows does not have any options available to fix a throttling problem like this.

Edit - It would also be a good idea to turn on GPU monitoring in the Options window so this information will be included in the log file too.

Chargero
11-04-2016, 10:19 PM
I did some searching last night and found another G751JY owner with the exact same problem.

https://rog.asus.com/forum/showthread.php?58588-G751JY-yes-sitting-at-800-MHZ-amp-frustrated

As soon as he used ThrottleStop to disable BD PROCHOT, his CPU immediately started running at full speed. Based on your testing so far, I think your laptop has the same problem.

Your ThrottleStop screenshot does not show any signs of throttling. Your CPU is running at 3400+ MHz like it should be. Try to get a screenshot of ThrottleStop with the Limit Reasons window open when your CPU is throttling and stuck at 798 MHz.

Limit Reasons shows what part of the CPU is causing the throttling. If a box lights up in red, that is the reason for the throttling that is presently happening. A yellow box means that some throttling was previously recorded but the CPU is not presently throttling due to that reason. After you boot up, open Limit Reasons and click on the headings, CORE, GPU and RING. This clears the previous throttling reasons so the yellow boxes should turn black. Some of these get set during the boot up phase. That is not important so you want to clear those boxes before you start testing. Also open up the ThrottleStop - Options window and check off, Add Limit Reasons to Log File. The log file will then contain throttling reasons so this data can be directly compared to the CPU multiplier.

When monitoring, run ThrottleStop by itself. Other monitoring programs like HWiNFO automatically delete the Limit Reasons data that is stored within the processor. If the Windows system logs are random or not 100% reliable then ignore this data. It was nice that Windows told you that there is a problem but now you need to fix it. Windows does not have any options available to fix a throttling problem like this.

Edit - It would also be a good idea to turn on GPU monitoring in the Options window so this information will be included in the log file too.
Throttlestop screenshot was taken when i have just turned my laptop) so no throttling there. While limit reason was turned right when ihad 798. Just to make it clear. But ok will try again).

unclewebb
11-05-2016, 12:33 AM
I just need to see a single screenshot that includes ThrottleStop showing 798 MHz and with Limit Reasons open too at the same time. This should give me a clue as to what is causing the throttling. Best to have the Log File option on so you have some numbers to confirm the throttling.

Chargero
11-05-2016, 11:27 AM
I just need to see a single screenshot that includes ThrottleStop showing 798 MHz and with Limit Reasons open too at the same time. This should give me a clue as to what is causing the throttling. Best to have the Log File option on so you have some numbers to confirm the throttling.

So here they are: the screen and pastebin. http://pastebin.com/hJBp3TnK
As i can see - there is nothing. (throttle started at 14.10 in the logs)
At 14.14.50 you can s me unpluggig and the clocks go back up. Also no signs of anything.

unclewebb
11-05-2016, 08:48 PM
The next time this happens, put a check mark in the ThrottleStop - Set Multiplier option.

EDP is showing up in the log file and it is also showing up in Limit Reasons. This stands for Electrical Design Point which is usually triggered when the current limit is set too low. Can you post a screenshot of the ThrottleStop TPL window? The Primary Plane Power Limits might show a clue.

Your laptop has an unusual problem. It is definitely not running like a 4720HQ should run.

Chargero
11-06-2016, 12:30 AM
The next time this happens, put a check mark in the ThrottleStop - Set Multiplier option.

EDP is showing up in the log file and it is also showing up in Limit Reasons. This stands for Electrical Design Point which is usually triggered when the current limit is set too low. Can you post a screenshot of the ThrottleStop TPL window? The Primary Plane Power Limits might show a clue.

Your laptop has an unusual problem. It is definitely not running like a 4720HQ should run.

Here is TRL window. Will check *set multiplier* tomorrow, going to sleep now).

Looking at this TRL window, might be this turbo time limit the case? I am not experienced enough with Throttlestop, so i might not unerstand it properly, but can it be that it just turns off turboboost after 8min? Checked eventlog and in most cases the fps-drop is at least close to 8min after *winlogon*.

unclewebb
11-06-2016, 03:27 AM
The turbo time limit is in seconds. The way these Intel CPUs are supposed to work is that they are allowed to run as fast as possible as long as they do not exceed 58 Watts. If the CPU is running an extreme stress test like Prime95, the CPU multiplier should throttle immediately to keep power consumption under 58 Watts. After approximately 8 seconds, the maximum power limit is reduced to 47 Watts and the maximum multiplier will throttle further if it needs to so power consumption does not exceed 47 Watts.

What we know so far is that the throttling you are experiencing has nothing to do with either of these built in turbo power limits. Your CPU is running well under these limits. Limit Reasons also shows that neither power limit has been reached. On a normal CPU, when these power limits are reached, the multiplier does not drop down to 8 and it does not get stuck at 8 for any length of time.

Here is an example of how my 4700MQ throttles when it reaches these limits just so you have a better understanding of Intel CPUs.

To create some stress, I ran the LinX program. When overclocked and all 4 cores are loaded, the 4700MQ can use the 34 multiplier. LinX puts such a huge load on the CPU that this is not possible so it immediately starts to throttle the multiplier to keep under the PL2 power limit.

http://i.imgur.com/YG9ceCE.png

The multiplier is averaging just over 30 and the CPU is running at just under the 56 Watt PL2 power limit. This will go on for a while until the time in the turbo time limit is used up. After that, the CPU is forced to drop down under 47 Watts which is the long term turbo power limit also known as PL1. To accomplish this, the CPU must immediately reduce the CPU multiplier.

http://i.imgur.com/uxqGAaA.png

The CPU multiplier is lower than before and this is keeping the CPU just under the 47 Watt limit. My CPU can run indefinitely at this speed. The CPU constantly adjusts the multiplier based on load to keep the CPU right at the edge of the 47 Watt limit. If the load is reduced slightly, the multiplier immediately increases. There is no lag. The CPU speed is constantly being adjusted. This is how a normal Intel CPU works. Your CPU on the other hand is not performing normally at all. It should never drop down to the 8 multiplier and get stuck there. Never.

It will be interesting to see if the Set Multiplier option can help with this. Try that first and then if that doesn't work, go into the FIVR window and try setting the Non Turbo Ratio to 1. After that, hit Apply or OK and see if that makes any difference when your CPU is throttling.

This is a very unique situation so I am just trying to come up with a few tricks to get around this problem.

Chargero
11-06-2016, 09:30 AM
The turbo time limit is in seconds. The way these Intel CPUs are supposed to work is that they are allowed to run as fast as possible as long as they do not exceed 58 Watts. If the CPU is running an extreme stress test like Prime95, the CPU multiplier should throttle immediately to keep power consumption under 58 Watts. After approximately 8 seconds, the maximum power limit is reduced to 47 Watts and the maximum multiplier will throttle further if it needs to so power consumption does not exceed 47 Watts.
.

Thx for making me better understand :D now its much easier.
So i tried *set multiplier*. And now it is even more complicated. When my FPS drops, multplier goes to 8, and we already know that. So when i use set multiplier to 34 it IS set to 34. BUT drop is still there :D. FPS is still low and nothing really changes. If i unbox *set multiplier* the multiplier gradually goes back to 8. No other options like clocks modulation help. So basically the only thing that helps is unplugging. It nevelates the problem till next restart.
So i suppose it is some problem with windows 10 power management or smth. Dont think it is something really with the CPU. Cause it works good after unplug. Strange...

unclewebb
11-07-2016, 01:11 AM
So when i use set multiplier to 34 it IS set to 34. BUT drop is still there :D. FPS is still low and nothing really changes.

Are you saying that the CPU runs at full speed when using ThrottleStop but the FPS are still dropping? It sounds like your GPU is also throttling. You could try running a log of your GPU using the GPU-Z program to confirm this. A GPU-Z log will show the MHz that the GPU is running at.

If CPU and GPU are both throttling, it might be due to lack of power so perhaps your power adapter is bad and it is not able to supply your computer with enough power. There could also be a problem with the power delivery circuits on your motherboard. For testing, try and find someone with a similar power adapter to see if it makes any difference.

Many manufacturers have shipped laptops with power adapters that are barely adequate. After a year or two, they might not able to fully power your laptop anymore.

Chargero
11-07-2016, 08:28 PM
Are you saying that the CPU runs at full speed when using ThrottleStop but the FPS are still dropping? It sounds like your GPU is also throttling. You could try running a log of your GPU using the GPU-Z program to confirm this. A GPU-Z log will show the MHz that the GPU is running at.

If CPU and GPU are both throttling, it might be due to lack of power so perhaps your power adapter is bad and it is not able to supply your computer with enough power. There could also be a problem with the power delivery circuits on your motherboard. For testing, try and find someone with a similar power adapter to see if it makes any difference.

Many manufacturers have shipped laptops with power adapters that are barely adequate. After a year or two, they might not able to fully power your laptop anymore.

Now i cant understand a single thing :D
1) about the logs in CPUZ, should i paste the whole report thing? (made one when i experience a drop and second when everything is ok)
2) The strangest thing (screenshot attached). When i experience a drop (ths time it was with no apps opened, just desktop) my CPU goes to 798 (as mentioned above) BUT! GPU goes to 540/2505 and stays there no matter what. I tried to run witcher while in a drop - gpu clocks didnt change at all. Then, after unplugging clocked went back to normal (witcher was closed), and while i reopened Witcher3 i got the same 540/2505 but with no lags.
P.S. ran GpuZ now so will have detailed logs now

Chargero
11-07-2016, 10:01 PM
Seems like i have found the problem.
To everyone who has the same problem: check your processes (system ones).
So i wanted to get confirmation using GPU-Z. So i opened it, opened CPU-Z, and opened task manager just in case, and sorted all processes by CPU usage (including system ones). So when *here comes the DROP* i noticed some suspicious sysem process *issch.exe* eating like 18% of CPU. Checked the place of this process and made some google search and found out that its a bitcoin miner. Just deleted it + cleared the task*insall shield update service* in windows scheduler. and it is ok for more than an hour now. Hope i wont see it again :D
Just to make it clear: I had a feeling that it is a virus cause not long ago i was short of time and didnt check for viruses my USB card after i used it in the university, and then on another computer some viruses were found on it. Still I have updated Kaspersky installed and ran scans several times, i even used windows defender *live cd* to check the system. they didnt find anything.
So be careful all and check your *appData* with your own eyes once in a while.
P.S. Special thanks to unclewebb for trying to help me!