PDA

View Full Version : Asus maximus x apex gskill ram compatibility issue (qvl)



TorwaK
11-22-2017, 03:06 PM
Hello,

I have installed my rig yesterday and noticed that GSKILL F4-3866C18D-32GTZR (DDR4-3866 - 2 x 16gb) kit is incompatible with the board. The RAM kit is in the board's QVL document however sometimes the computer doesn't boot and shows error 55 at Qcode. In order to fix the issue you have to switch off/on the PC. The problem occurs only when I select Auto or Mode 2 option at Maximus Tweak. There is no issue with Mode 1 however I get 8%-12% less performance from RAM.

https://www.gskill.com/en/product/f4-3866c18d-32gtzr

Please advise.

Thanks.

TorwaK
11-22-2017, 05:01 PM
Update - Mode 1 has the same issue.

Silent Scone@ROG
11-22-2017, 06:14 PM
Update - Mode 1 has the same issue.

Try Tweak Mode 1 once again, but increase VCCSA and IO manually to around 1.2v-1.25v

Tweak mode 1 has relaxed memory rules, which is why you're able to pass POST stress tests easier.

TorwaK
11-22-2017, 08:36 PM
Try Tweak Mode 1 once again, but increase VCCSA and IO manually to around 1.2v-1.25v

Tweak mode 1 has relaxed memory rules, which is why you're able to pass POST stress tests easier.

I set VCCSA and VCCIO voltages manually. When the system boots up normally it set these voltages around 1.3V automatically. So I manually entered them however it didn't work.

I ran the PC at 5.3Ghz and completed Prime95 (4 hours) and RealBench (2 hours). It's absolutely rock solid. However this cold boot problem due RAM is annoying.

Silent Scone@ROG
11-22-2017, 09:10 PM
I set VCCSA and VCCIO voltages manually. When the system boots up normally it set these voltages around 1.3V automatically. So I manually entered them however it didn't work.

I ran the PC at 5.3Ghz and completed Prime95 (4 hours) and RealBench (2 hours). It's absolutely rock solid. However this cold boot problem due RAM is annoying.

It's because the memory isn't stable enough to pass POST stress tests 100% of the time. 1.3v is potentially too much, some CPU will be more comfortable with less than that. You'll need to tune the system accordingly. More voltage to these rails can be just as damning as too little. You can also set a higher DRAM voltage.

Failing any headway there, you'll have to relax some of the sub timings further. The fact the system posts most of the time in Tweak Mode 1 suggests you're not far from being stable.

morph.
11-22-2017, 10:29 PM
Is there an equivalent setting for strix boards regarding mode 1?

Shouldn't setting the board to XMP profile also adjust this as it seems like a handful of people are having post issues with ram these days.

I can also confirm IO/SA voltages on auto for my ram:
Gskill F4-3466C16D-32GTZR
VCCSA: 1.272v (auto)
VCCIO: 1.312v (auto)

Had trouble posting it too and even loosened the timing to no luck.
What worked since was just dropping the clock speed to 3333mhz, not ideal but at least the comptuer can post/boot and is useable.

Shamino
11-23-2017, 02:10 AM
hi you can workaround this inconsistent booting by going into dram timing, set mrc fast boot to enabled.

TorwaK
11-23-2017, 09:10 AM
hi you can workaround this inconsistent booting by going into dram timing, set mrc fast boot to enabled.

Dude you are just awesome.:cool: It's fixed.

Many thanks to everyone for their comments.

Silent Scone@ROG
11-23-2017, 01:57 PM
Dude you are just awesome.:cool: It's fixed.

Many thanks to everyone for their comments.


FYI this option disables memory training, so best to check the memory stability with HCI Memtest to check for errors within the OS. Setting MRC fastboot works for some and not others, but if you're still getting memory errors in HCI, it's more of a band aid.

TorwaK
11-23-2017, 03:50 PM
FYI this option disables memory training, so best to check the memory stability with HCI Memtest to check for errors within the OS. Setting MRC fastboot works for some and not others, but if you're still getting memory errors in HCI, it's more of a band aid.

I already tested the RAM sticks using memtest around 5 hours. It passed each test and completed successfully. I believe the issue is related to BIOS. High memory frequency (3866Mhz) and my CPU overclock prevents the boot due to not sufficient voltages VCCIO/VCCSA etc.

Probably it will be fixed at future BIOS releases.

Silent Scone@ROG
11-23-2017, 05:36 PM
I already tested the RAM sticks using memtest around 5 hours. It passed each test and completed successfully. I believe the issue is related to BIOS. High memory frequency (3866Mhz) and my CPU overclock prevents the boot due to not sufficient voltages VCCIO/VCCSA etc.

Probably it will be fixed at future BIOS releases.

Memtest86? or HCI Memtest? The former won't tell you anything conclusive at all and is not relevant anymore. My last post stands, MRC FB disables memory training after the initial cold boot and retains settings in NVRAM, but you need test with a more thorough memory stress test to conclude the system is now stable.

As I say, if you are HCI memtest stable then there's no concern using the feature suggested by Shamino. The issue is not with the UEFI version, but with the applied settings not being stable enough to pass memory training.

VSS-HH
11-29-2017, 07:48 PM
Dude you are just awesome.:cool: It's fixed.

Many thanks to everyone for their comments.

MXA this is a strange board, 4k no post in DIMM A_1, DIMM B_1 4k post without error
my best settings (http://fs5.directupload.net/images/171129/yrrhv6il.png)
http://fs5.directupload.net/images/171129/yrrhv6il.png

http://fs5.directupload.net/images/171129/temp/yrrhv6il.png (http://www.directupload.net/file/d/4921/yrrhv6il_png.htm)

Magma
04-16-2018, 10:10 AM
Hi guys. I meet the same problem like you, my g skill ram at 4400 is really badly detected with the Apex X motherboard.
I suggest you to do like me, writing a mail to asus, asking for new bios versions upgrade, with new memory table in.
I asked them to make new bios with better memory profile, with xmp mode, it's not normal for us to pay more 350 for a motherboard like strix series or Apex, and to be still limited at ram @ 3800, when today, we can buy new ram who can be stable with xmp mode until 5 Ghz.
I think more we are to ask them to make new bios, and so, more fast our ask will be taken in charge, and finally, have a positive answer.

Until that, so, just wait and pray... ;-)

Silent Scone@ROG
04-16-2018, 10:28 AM
Hi guys. I meet the same problem like you, my g skill ram at 4400 is really badly detected with the Apex X motherboard.
I suggest you to do like me, writing a mail to asus, asking for new bios versions upgrade, with new memory table in.
I asked them to make new bios with better memory profile, with xmp mode, it's not normal for us to pay more 350 for a motherboard like strix series or Apex, and to be still limited at ram @ 3800, when today, we can buy new ram who can be stable with xmp mode until 5 Ghz.
I think more we are to ask them to make new bios, and so, more fast our ask will be taken in charge, and finally, have a positive answer.

Until that, so, just wait and pray... ;-)


You can wait all you want, none of that will improve the capability of the CPU IMC. Those speeds will require manual tuning if the CPU sample is able at all. If looking for plug and play stick to memory kits at or below 3600.

Phillyflyer
04-17-2018, 05:00 PM
I set VCCSA and VCCIO voltages manually. When the system boots up normally it set these voltages around 1.3V automatically. So I manually entered them however it didn't work.

I ran the PC at 5.3Ghz and completed Prime95 (4 hours) and RealBench (2 hours). It's absolutely rock solid. However this cold boot problem due RAM is annoying.


Care to share ur 5.3ghz overclock settings for Prime 95 stability ? Can u post some stability screenshots?

tt0ne
03-18-2019, 04:20 AM
G.Skill F4-3866C18D-32GTZR - the same kit as the OP has absolutely does not work with the Apex XI. Just like the OP stated that the kit was listed on the QVL list for his motherboard it is also listed on the Apex XI QVL. Please realize that this kit came out of my Apex X where it ran in my daily driver for the last two years. It doesn't matter if I choose XMP 1 - XMP2 or try and configure it manually. The fact of the matter is, if it's on the QVL it means I should be able to configure XMP and move on - not that I would ever just accept default settings but that's another story lol...

Anyways, unless someone comes on and states they have this kit working on their Apex XI I think Asus should take it off their next revision of the QVL. My two cents.

For the record, went to the shelf and grabbed an old set of G.Skill F4-3200C14D-32GTZ and that kit worked exactly as one would expect listed on the QVL (which it is).

NOTE: Just to avoid anyone suggesting it is my memory controller I did this https://hwbot.org/submission/4105030 with the same Apex XI and 9900k. It's a crappy score (unlike Jabby's score at 2nd place - nice!) but the point is that 4800 mhz at 19-19-19 is ridiculously high.

jab383
03-18-2019, 01:37 PM
I've wondered how much OC headroom those HOF's have, ttOne. They should be quick at 19-19-19 and high bandwidth at that speed.

I agree that properly working RAMs on the QVL should boot straight from XMP. All the APEXes I've used did so with 3600, 4266 and 4400 speeds - haven't tried the subject 3866 kit. If the 3866 fails repeatedly with different CPUs, including ttOne's very good one, I think the 3866 kits have a problem. Something like the XMP tables borked in a way that just passes the QVL tests with the (small? Engineering samples?) set of CPUs used in the limited time ASUS has for such tests before fielding the motherboard model. ASUS might well take this sort of feedback.

Workarounds adjusting Vccio and Vccsa have been suggested above. Another suggestion is to increase DRAM Voltage - in steps of .01 volts up to 1.45 volts max. That has been effective when other motherboard models had trouble with XMP.

If the trouble is only with POST and training, DRAM voltage can be set higher in the Extreme Tweaking tab, then in the Tweaker's Paradise subtab, set the Eventual DRAM Voltage back to the XMP level. That will give better RAM performance while training, then less stress in everyday use.

tt0ne
03-19-2019, 05:54 AM
What makes those HoF sticks so crazy is that I'm hitting that speed and timings in dual channel - which with the Apex X and a 8086k I could only do with one stick in single channel mode - so kudos not just to Galax but also to Asus and Intel ;-)

I think the set in question is an anomaly. On the Apex X I had them running at 4000 16-17-17 CR2 full prime stable (they were part of my daily driver gear and not so much for benching).

Marco

PS: Man, grats on being #1 overall in the USA for this current league year! Crazy seeing BigBlock and Splave behind you :-)

jab383
03-19-2019, 01:31 PM
That ranking is just a matter of luck right now. Something like quantity over quality. When the elite overclockers drop their sandbags in the contests, their quality will swamp me.

tt0ne
03-20-2019, 12:02 AM
Still, enjoy it for now!

tt0ne
04-11-2019, 05:20 AM
I finally got these sticks working with my Apex XI and figured I'd share my settings with anyone who may be searching and find this thread in the future. These settings are prime stable for me and are in my daily driver system so I push for maximum performance without compromising stability. It takes a lot of time to dial in these double sided 16 GB sticks hopefully this will save some time for others:

NOTE: I had to use Maximus Tweak Mode 1. This causes the way IO Latency and RTL works with this specific memory. Normally with Mode 2 you'd dial in your latency settings by setting your IO Latency Offset to 21 and increase by one until the system no longer trained and then dial it back by one and set your IO Latency manually. With Mode 1 when set your offset to the same base of 21 but you decrease the number by 1 until you can no longer train. Additionally in this mode the offset changes RTLs and not the IOL. The IO Latency values will not change. With my sticks they stayed at 13 for the first DIMM and 14 for the second DIMM (well, since these are Double Sided DIMMs you really see 13/13/14/14). I was able to get both to 13 because once I was dialed you can almost always lower the second DIMM by one on the RTL and IOL manually. In other words, by using the IO offset at 21 and decreasing until I got to 16 I was left with 67/67/69/69/13/13/14/14 which I manually changed to 67/67/68/68/13/13/13/13. Also, to make it even more confusing I've noticed that how Mode 1 and Mode 2 interact with memory sticks and what they will affect and how they will effect stuff is not consistent but I don't think anyone outside of the Asus engineer's could explain why.

Running a 9900k at 5.1 (synced AVX with no speed decrease) @ 1.27v and 4.6 ghz cache. Memory is running at 4000 Mhz at 1.45v.

Applicable BIOS settings below (If it's not lsited then I left it at auto):

[GROUP 1]

Ai Overclock Tuner [Manual]
BCLK Frequency [100.0000]
ASUS MultiCore Enhancement [Enabled – Remove All limits]
SVID Behavior [Auto]
AVX Instruction Core Ratio Negative Offset [0]
CPU Core Ratio [Sync All Cores]
1-Core Ratio Limit [51]
DRAM Odd Ratio Mode [Enabled]
DRAM Frequency [DDR4-4000MHz]
Xtreme Tweaking [Disabled]
CPU SVID Support [Enabled]
CPU Core/Cache Current Limit Max. [255.75]
Min. CPU Cache Ratio [46]
Max CPU Cache Ratio [46]
BCLK Aware Adaptive Voltage [Enabled]
CPU Core/Cache Voltage [Manual Mode]
CPU Core Voltage Override [1.270]
DRAM Voltage [1.4600]
CPU VCCIO Voltage [1.23125]
CPU System Agent Voltage [1.25625]
PLL Termination Voltage [1.02000]
CPU Standby Voltage [1.020]

[GROUP 2]

Maximus Tweak [Mode 1]
DRAM CAS# Latency [18]
DRAM RAS# to CAS# Delay [18]
DRAM RAS# ACT Time [28]
DRAM Command Rate [2N]
DRAM RAS# to RAS# Delay L [6]
DRAM RAS# to RAS# Delay S [4]
DRAM REF Cycle Time [290]
DRAM Refresh Interval [65535]
DRAM WRITE Recovery Time [10]
DRAM READ to PRE Time [6]
DRAM FOUR ACT WIN Time [16]
DRAM CKE Minimum Pulse Width [6]
DRAM Write Latency [14]

[GROUP 3]

DRAM RTL (CHA DIMM0 Rank0) [67]
DRAM RTL (CHA DIMM0 Rank1) [67]
DRAM RTL (CHB DIMM0 Rank0) [68]
DRAM RTL (CHB DIMM0 Rank1) [68]
DRAM IOL (CHA DIMM0 Rank0) [13]
DRAM IOL (CHA DIMM0 Rank1) [13]
DRAM IOL (CHB DIMM0 Rank0) [13]
DRAM IOL (CHB DIMM0 Rank1) [13]
CHA IO_Latency_offset [18]
CHB IO_Latency_offset [18]

[GROUP 4]

tRDRD_sg [6]
tRDRD_dg [4]
tRDWR_sg [14]
tRDWR_dg [14]
tWRWR_sg [6]
tWRWR_dg [4]
tWRRD_sg [28]
tWRRD_dg [24]
tRDRD_dr [6]
tRDRD_dd [6]
tRDWR_dr [14]
tRDWR_dd [14]
tWRWR_dr [8]
tWRWR_dd [8]
tWRRD_dr [6]
tWRRD_dd [6]

[GROUP 5]

MRC Fast Boot [Disabled]
MCH Full Check [Enabled]

[GROUP 6]

CPU Load-line Calibration [Level 6]
Synch ACDC Loadline with VRM Loadline [Enabled]
CPU Current Capability [140%]
VRM Spread Spectrum [Disabled]
Active Frequency Mode [Disabled]
CPU Power Duty Control [Extreme]
CPU Power Phase Control [Extreme]
CPU Power Thermal Control [141]
CPU VRM Thermal Control [Disabled]
DRAM Current Capability [130%]
DRAM Switching Frequency [Manual]
Fixed DRAM Switching Frequency(KHz) [500]

[GROUP 7]

Intel(R) SpeedStep(tm) [Disabled]
Turbo Mode [Enabled]
Long Duration Package Power Limit [4095]
Package Power Time Window [127]
Short Duration Package Power Limit [4095]
TVB Voltage Optimizations [Disabled]

[GROUP 8]

Realtime Memory Timing [Disabled]
FCLK Frequency for Early Power On [1GHz]
BCLK Spread Spectrum [Disabled]
DMI Voltage [Auto]
Core PLL Voltage [1.00000]

[GROUP 9]

Software Guard Extensions (SGX) [Disabled]
Tcc Offset Time Window [Disabled]
Intel (VMX) Virtualization Technology [Disabled]
Boot performance mode [Turbo Performance]
Intel(R) SpeedStep(tm) [Disabled]
Intel(R) Speed Shift Technology [Disabled]
Turbo Mode [Enabled]
CPU C-states [Disabled]
CFG Lock [Disabled]
VT-d [Disabled]
Above 4G Decoding [Enabled]
Memory Remap [Enabled]