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  1. #11
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    MotherboardWS-X299-PRO
    ProcessorIntel Core i7-7820X
    Memory (part number)KHX3200C16D4/4GX
    Graphics Card #1EVGA RTX 2080 XC Ultra Gaming
    Sound CardHyperX(USB)
    CPU CoolerNoctua NH-U9S
    CaseFractal Design Define R6 White
    Power SupplyCooler Master v750
    Keyboard Cherry MX-Board 3.0
    Mouse Zowie FK1
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    OS WIndows 1903
    H-de's Avatar
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    anyone else tested 1102 yet?

    Edit:
    1102 is removed from the BIOS Page, so i guess they were able to reproduce it
    Last edited by H-de; 08-13-2019 at 06:49 PM.

  2. #12
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    No noticeable improvement on 1102

    I still see BIOS 1102 available on the download page but they have pulled 1001. I went ahead and flashed from 1001 to 1102 and have seen no noticeable improvement but as far as I can tell it hasn't gotten worse. As with 1001, I tried disabling the OS level speculative execution protections but saw no significant change (~5%) but my testing has been limited so far on 1102.

    Unfortunately I have not had any luck flashing to a previous BIOS version, it is rejected via EZ Flash in the UEFI console and the BIOS flashback feature has not been successful either (that may be due to user error, I haven't used it before). I really don't want to disassemble the computer and RMA the board but the performance decreases I'm seeing are completely absurd. I also don't want to lose the speculative execution protections either so it's definitely a bad situation. On the bright side, they didn't completely brick it and the manual CPU fan control actually works in 1102 after Asus broke it in 1001

    I've included a summary of my experience below in case it can help anyone or maybe ASUS engineering. Clearly Asus needs more QC testers because some stuff like breaking manual CPU fan control is just downright silly. I volunteer because this board is almost useless to me with a 50% performance loss so I'm willing to get crazy with some alpha builds. If I have to remove the board from the system, I want it to be completely dead lol.

    System components:
    Asus WS X299 Sage/10G
    Intel i9-9920X
    GSkill Trident Z RGB 3733 8x8 (also used a hyperx 3000 8x8 kit on both bios revisions - both kits are on QVL)
    VROC Raid 0 Optane 905 x2
    Nvidia 2080 ti x2
    Some other parts that are not relevant

    Software info:
    - started on BIOS version 905, then upgraded to 1001 and then 1102
    - computer initially was running Win10 pro 1809 was then upgraded to Win10 pro 1903 when that became available)
    - all applicable os level speculative execution (SE) protections have enabled via registry in all of the OS builds

    Issue description:
    - massive performance drops of up to 50% in some workloads after flashing BIOS update 1001
    - program launches became noticeably slower and games that had never been CPU bottlenecked before suddenly were
    - benchmarks confirmed a huge loss of performance, far beyond what is expected to be lost from SE protections (no SE protections were listed in notes for 1001)
    - my total time spy score dropped from ~21,500 to ~15,500 and the entire drop is due to the CPU (from 39fps to 17fps). This loss is consistent and performance stays the same regardless of OS re-installation.
    - cinebench losses were only about 800 points, unfortunately I can't find those screenshots
    - most games that ran well previously, do not anymore
    - memory bandwidth dropped significantly for both kits (was in the middle of running memtest for long periods when bios update came out and saw about a major bandwidth drop on the memtest86 running page - not sure how accurate that is tho)

    Troubleshooting steps after flashing from 0905 to 1001:
    - disabled os level SE protections, no change
    - fresh install of Win10 1809, no change
    - fresh install of Win10 1903, no change
    - swap memory kits, no change
    - clear CMOS multiple times, validate settings
    - fresh install of Win10 1809 without using VROC, no change
    - extensive hardware testing, no issues found
    - cried under my desk for about 2 days because my new expensive system no longer performs well and I can't fix it
    - eventually ran out of tears, checked Asus page yesterday and saw 1001 had been pulled and 1102 was out
    - excitedly flashed 1102 and saw no performance improvement
    - then I found this thread. Hello everyone!
    Last edited by benderisgreat; 08-14-2019 at 03:10 PM. Reason: typos

  3. #13
    New ROGer Array H-de PC Specs
    H-de PC Specs
    MotherboardWS-X299-PRO
    ProcessorIntel Core i7-7820X
    Memory (part number)KHX3200C16D4/4GX
    Graphics Card #1EVGA RTX 2080 XC Ultra Gaming
    Sound CardHyperX(USB)
    CPU CoolerNoctua NH-U9S
    CaseFractal Design Define R6 White
    Power SupplyCooler Master v750
    Keyboard Cherry MX-Board 3.0
    Mouse Zowie FK1
    Headset HyperX Cloud 2
    Mouse Pad QCK+
    OS WIndows 1903
    H-de's Avatar
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    Y̵o̵u̵ ̵c̵a̵n̵ ̵u̵s̵e̵ ̵A̵S̵U̵S̵ ̵F̵l̵a̵s̵h̵ ̵B̵a̵c̵k̵ ̵b̵u̵t̵t̵o̵n̵ ̵o̵n̵ ̵y̵o̵u̵r̵ ̵M̵o̵t̵h̵e̵r̵b̵o̵a̵r̵d̵ ̵b̵u̵t̵ ̵y̵o̵u̵ ̵n̵e̵e̵d̵ ̵a̵ ̵U̵S̵B̵ ̵S̵t̵i̵c̵k̵.̵
    ̵Y̵o̵u̵ ̵a̵l̵s̵o̵ ̵n̵e̵e̵d̵ ̵t̵o̵ ̵r̵e̵n̵a̵m̵e̵ ̵t̵h̵e̵ ̵B̵I̵O̵S̵ ̵t̵o̵ ̵a̵ ̵s̵p̵e̵c̵i̵f̵i̵c̵ ̵n̵a̵m̵e̵,̵ ̵u̵ ̵c̵a̵n̵ ̵f̵i̵n̵d̵ ̵i̵t̵ ̵i̵n̵ ̵t̵h̵e̵ ̵m̵a̵n̵u̵a̵l̵s̵.̵
    edit:
    My bad your Motherboard don't have ASUS Flash Back
    Use "advance.rma.eu@asus.com" and ask for a other Method to flash BIOS 0905


    BIOS got removed from WS-X299-PRO https://www.asus.com/de/Motherboards...HelpDesk_BIOS/
    But still live on WS-X299-SAGE-10G https://www.asus.com/de/Motherboards...HelpDesk_BIOS/

    BIOS has been removed also from WS X299 SAGE https://www.asus.com/de/Motherboards...HelpDesk_BIOS/

  4. #14
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    Quote Originally Posted by H-de View Post
    Y̵o̵u̵ ̵c̵a̵n̵ ̵u̵s̵e̵ ̵A̵S̵U̵S̵ ̵F̵l̵a̵s̵h̵ ̵B̵a̵c̵k̵ ̵b̵u̵t̵t̵o̵n̵ ̵o̵n̵ ̵y̵o̵u̵r̵ ̵M̵o̵t̵h̵e̵r̵b̵o̵a̵r̵d̵ ̵b̵u̵t̵ ̵y̵o̵u̵ ̵n̵e̵e̵d̵ ̵a̵ ̵U̵S̵B̵ ̵S̵t̵i̵c̵k̵.̵
    ̵Y̵o̵u̵ ̵a̵l̵s̵o̵ ̵n̵e̵e̵d̵ ̵t̵o̵ ̵r̵e̵n̵a̵m̵e̵ ̵t̵h̵e̵ ̵B̵I̵O̵S̵ ̵t̵o̵ ̵a̵ ̵s̵p̵e̵c̵i̵f̵i̵c̵ ̵n̵a̵m̵e̵,̵ ̵u̵ ̵c̵a̵n̵ ̵f̵i̵n̵d̵ ̵i̵t̵ ̵i̵n̵ ̵t̵h̵e̵ ̵m̵a̵n̵u̵a̵l̵s̵.̵
    edit:
    My bad your Motherboard don't have ASUS Flash Back
    Use "advance.rma.eu@asus.com" and ask for a other Method to flash BIOS 0905
    The WS X299 Sage/10G does have BIOS flashback but unfortunately it's not working for flashing versions older than the current running version. I opened a case with Asus but I'm worried that it may not be possible to go back to 0905 due to some Intel microcode updates for speculative execution vulnerabilities allegedly not being reversible (not sure if that's only applicable to CPU or if it involves BIOS as well). 1001 didn't have any microcode or speculative execution patches listed in the release notes but 1102 does.

    If anyone reads this and is still on 1001, I highly recommend waiting to flash 1102 if you're using the WS X299 Sage/10G until Asus confirms whether or not 1102 is reversible. (EDIT: It is reversible, BIOS flashback is just picky about USB drives. See later post for details)

    Thanks to everyone posting info in this thread and I'll post an update once I hear back from Asus support.
    Last edited by benderisgreat; 08-15-2019 at 03:23 PM. Reason: Update info

  5. #15
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    Hi everyone,

    After emailing with Asus support, they have confirmed the performance issues still exist in version 1102 and that they will be pulling it from the download page (but it's still up at the moment, so restrain yourselves from downloading it lol).

    "As per our product engineers, the 1001/1102 BIOS are removed due to the fact of the performance issue customer has encountered. I highly recommend the customer to perform BIOS flashback to 0905 which is certified BIOS from Asus in order to have most stable system with best processor performance"

    It turns out the issue with BIOS flashback was that it's very picky about the USB drive you use. I tried 4 different USB drives before I found one that worked. It appears to be something related to the hardware of the USB drive since USB 2.0 vs 3.0 didn't seem to make a difference and all drives were MBR with FAT32 partitions. (EDIT: Problem was I'm dumb and forgot to run "convert mbr" after "clean" in diskpart. oops.)

    The manual for the WS x299 Sage/10G is a bit vague so I've included a few extra notes to the manual steps:

    1- Find the oldest, smallest USB 2.0 drive you can. Format it to MBR and add a FAT32 partition.
    2- Download BIOS 0905, extract it, rename the .CAP file to "WSXTG.CAP", and copy it to the root of the USB drive you just formatted
    3- Shutdown the computer and either unplug the PSU or turn off the PSU switch for 30 seconds. Plug in or turn PSU back on, but not the computer.
    4- Make sure the USB drive is in the Flashback port (has a green ring around it)
    5- Hold the BIOS flashback button (by the U.2 port) for 3 seconds and release. The green light next to it should continue to blink after the button is released if working properly. If it stays solid green, somethings wrong - either the USB drive is not compatible or there is an error with the partition or bios file. If the light stays solid green, you can turn the computer back on - don't wait for the solid green light, it'll never turn off.
    6- Once the blinking green light goes out, turn the computer back on and should be back on glorious BIOS 0905. Reconfigure your BIOS settings and you're good to go!

    My performance is back to where it should be so wooohooooo!!! But also I lost some of the speculative execution protections so awwwww.

    Since Asus is aware of the issue and this a "workstation" class board, I'm hoping for a fairly quick resolution and volunteered to test beta BIOS if needed (obviously someone needs to test this stuff more ). I'll update this thread if anything new and/or exciting happens. Many thanks to John Erick T. and Adam P. from Asus customer support who were very prompt in bringing the issue to the attention of engineering.

    See you all at the next BIOS release!
    Last edited by benderisgreat; 08-16-2019 at 01:09 AM. Reason: corrections

  6. #16
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    Quote Originally Posted by benderisgreat View Post
    I still see BIOS 1102 available on the download page but they have pulled 1001. I went ahead and flashed from 1001 to 1102 and have seen no noticeable improvement but as far as I can tell it hasn't gotten worse. As with 1001, I tried disabling the OS level speculative execution protections but saw no significant change (~5%) but my testing has been limited so far on 1102.

    Unfortunately I have not had any luck flashing to a previous BIOS version, it is rejected via EZ Flash in the UEFI console and the BIOS flashback feature has not been successful either (that may be due to user error, I haven't used it before). I really don't want to disassemble the computer and RMA the board but the performance decreases I'm seeing are completely absurd. I also don't want to lose the speculative execution protections either so it's definitely a bad situation. On the bright side, they didn't completely brick it and the manual CPU fan control actually works in 1102 after Asus broke it in 1001

    I've included a summary of my experience below in case it can help anyone or maybe ASUS engineering. Clearly Asus needs more QC testers because some stuff like breaking manual CPU fan control is just downright silly. I volunteer because this board is almost useless to me with a 50% performance loss so I'm willing to get crazy with some alpha builds. If I have to remove the board from the system, I want it to be completely dead lol.

    System components:
    Asus WS X299 Sage/10G
    Intel i9-9920X
    GSkill Trident Z RGB 3733 8x8 (also used a hyperx 3000 8x8 kit on both bios revisions - both kits are on QVL)
    VROC Raid 0 Optane 905 x2
    Nvidia 2080 ti x2
    Some other parts that are not relevant

    Software info:
    - started on BIOS version 905, then upgraded to 1001 and then 1102
    - computer initially was running Win10 pro 1809 was then upgraded to Win10 pro 1903 when that became available)
    - all applicable os level speculative execution (SE) protections have enabled via registry in all of the OS builds

    Issue description:
    - massive performance drops of up to 50% in some workloads after flashing BIOS update 1001
    - program launches became noticeably slower and games that had never been CPU bottlenecked before suddenly were
    - benchmarks confirmed a huge loss of performance, far beyond what is expected to be lost from SE protections (no SE protections were listed in notes for 1001)
    - my total time spy score dropped from ~21,500 to ~15,500 and the entire drop is due to the CPU (from 39fps to 17fps). This loss is consistent and performance stays the same regardless of OS re-installation.
    - cinebench losses were only about 800 points, unfortunately I can't find those screenshots
    - most games that ran well previously, do not anymore
    - memory bandwidth dropped significantly for both kits (was in the middle of running memtest for long periods when bios update came out and saw about a major bandwidth drop on the memtest86 running page - not sure how accurate that is tho)

    Troubleshooting steps after flashing from 0905 to 1001:
    - disabled os level SE protections, no change
    - fresh install of Win10 1809, no change
    - fresh install of Win10 1903, no change
    - swap memory kits, no change
    - clear CMOS multiple times, validate settings
    - fresh install of Win10 1809 without using VROC, no change
    - extensive hardware testing, no issues found
    - cried under my desk for about 2 days because my new expensive system no longer performs well and I can't fix it
    - eventually ran out of tears, checked Asus page yesterday and saw 1001 had been pulled and 1102 was out
    - excitedly flashed 1102 and saw no performance improvement
    - then I found this thread. Hello everyone!
    You need to format the USB stick that you put the BIOS on with FAT32 and MBR ....NOT GUID, which is what Windows 10 formats it as by default...so use command prompt.

    Then rename the BIOS to WSXTG.CAP and put it on the root of the USB stick. Shut down the system, then hold down the BIOS_FLSHBK button for 3 seconds and it will pulsate, then start pulsating faster if it finds it and it will flash it.

    I downgraded from 1102 to 0905 because 1102 broke GPU performance which broke everything else. There's something wrong with the ABOVE 4G Performance button.

  7. #17
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    Quote Originally Posted by izotope1 View Post
    You need to format the USB stick that you put the BIOS on with FAT32 and MBR ....NOT GUID, which is what Windows 10 formats it as by default...so use command prompt.
    ^ 100% correct. My error was I didn't run "convert mbr" after running "clean" in diskpart. Me dumb lol Thanks @izotopel
    Last edited by benderisgreat; 08-16-2019 at 01:03 AM. Reason: typos

  8. #18
    New ROGer Array H-de PC Specs
    H-de PC Specs
    MotherboardWS-X299-PRO
    ProcessorIntel Core i7-7820X
    Memory (part number)KHX3200C16D4/4GX
    Graphics Card #1EVGA RTX 2080 XC Ultra Gaming
    Sound CardHyperX(USB)
    CPU CoolerNoctua NH-U9S
    CaseFractal Design Define R6 White
    Power SupplyCooler Master v750
    Keyboard Cherry MX-Board 3.0
    Mouse Zowie FK1
    Headset HyperX Cloud 2
    Mouse Pad QCK+
    OS WIndows 1903
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    New BIOS v1201

    Gonna test this one out

  9. #19
    New ROGer Array H-de PC Specs
    H-de PC Specs
    MotherboardWS-X299-PRO
    ProcessorIntel Core i7-7820X
    Memory (part number)KHX3200C16D4/4GX
    Graphics Card #1EVGA RTX 2080 XC Ultra Gaming
    Sound CardHyperX(USB)
    CPU CoolerNoctua NH-U9S
    CaseFractal Design Define R6 White
    Power SupplyCooler Master v750
    Keyboard Cherry MX-Board 3.0
    Mouse Zowie FK1
    Headset HyperX Cloud 2
    Mouse Pad QCK+
    OS WIndows 1903
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    The bug Is fixed with 1201

    Finally

  10. #20
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    1201 is working well for me too so far! Performance appears to be just a slight bit better than 0905. Hooray!


    1201 isn't visible on the US download page yet so change "us" to "gb" in the bios download URL if you can't see it yet.

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