X570 Crosshair VIII Hero: Relationship Between BIOS and Ryzen DRAM Calculator

[ationfictons]

I've never overclocked before and thought I'd start by overclocking the memory. I need some help mapping what the Ryzen DRAM Calculator (v 1.62):

https://www.techpowerup.com/download...am-calculator/

says I should use to the fields in my X570 Crosshair VIII Hero's BIOS.

Currently, everything related to overclocking in the BIOS is the default "Auto" except that I've set it to use the D.O.C.P. profile in the memory.

Into the DRAM Calculator, I've entered what I believe to be the correct values for my system:

• Processor: "Ryzen 2 gen" (which should be my Zen2 3700X)
• Memory Type: Samsung B-die (I'm pretty sure - RAMMon says Samsung, the web says b-die)
• Profile version: V1 (that's what people say to use)
• Memory Rank: 1 (ditto)
• Frequency (MT/s): 3200 (that's what the memory is rated for, so I used it as the safest)
• BCLK: 100 (unchanged in BIOS)
• DIMM Modules: 2
• Motherboard: X570

(My memory consists of two banks of G.Skill F4-3200C14D-16GTZ DDR4, so that's where much of the above comes from)

I hit the purple "R-XMP" button at the bottom and it grabbed the timing information from my memory to complete the left column. I then hit the green "Calculate SAFE" button to get safe overclocking values.



I've managed to map the center values on the Calculator's "Main" page (the t... timings) to values in my BIOS. But, I'm at a loss for about half of the values in the right column. Could someone point me in the right direction for finding the place to set the following Recommended values in my BIOS?

• DRAM Voltage: 1.35
• SOC VOltage: 1.025
• cLDO VDDG Voltage : 0.900
• cLDO VDDP Voltage: 0.900
• BGS: Disabled

Then, there's the Calculator's "Advanced" page where I can't find anything equivalent in my BIOS. Ditto for its "Power Supply System" page. I'd appreciate any help there, too. I've included screenshot of those pages since there's too much to type here.

[ationfictons]

I waded through my Crosshair VIII Hero's BIOS (version 1105) and found most of the locations that equate to what 1usmus' Ryzen DRAM Calculator gives. I'm including the information, below, in case it helps anyone else. Unfortunately, 1) I entered the data into OneNote and it's doing its darnedest to make sure I can't get the information out, and 2) I can't get this forum to put lines between the table elements. So, this might not be the prettiest thing to look at. Sorry.

Remember, these numbers are for my memory on my motherboard. So, the raw numbers probably won't help you. It's the final column describing where to put those numbers in the BIOS that are relevant here.

DRAM Calculator's Main Page

Field	SAFE t-values	BIOS Location: All under Extreme Tweaker > DRAM Timing Control
tCL	14	"DRAM CAS# Latency"
tRCDWR	14	Switch order
tRCDRD	14	Switch order
tRP	14	"DRAM RAS# PRE Time"
tRAS	30	"DRAM RAS# ACT Time"
tRC	44
tRRDS	4
tRRDL	6
tFAW	34
tWTRS	4
tWTRL	12
tWR	12
tRDRD SCL	4
tWRWR SCL	4
tRFC	307
tRFC (alt)	312
tCWL	14
tRTP	8
tRDWR	7
tWRRD	3
tWRWR SC	1
tWRWR SD	7
tWRWR DD	7
tRDRD SC	1
tRDRD SD	5
tRDRD DD	5
tCKE	8

Voltage Block (voltage range)	Min	Rec	Max	BIOS Location: All under Extreme Tweaker
DRAM Voltage	1.34	1.35	1.36
SOC Voltage	0.975	1.025	1.05	"CPU SOC Voltage"?
cLDO VDDG Voltage	0.9	0.9	0.95	Can't Find
cLDO VDDP Voltage	0.7	0.9	1.1

Misc Items	Value	BIOS Location
Power Down mode	Enabled	Extreme Tweaker > DRAM Timing Control
Gear Down mode	Enabled	Extreme Tweaker > DRAM Timing Control
Command Rate	1T	Extreme Tweaker > DRAM Timing Control
BGS	Disabled	BankGroupSwap at Advanced > AMD CBS > UMC Common Options > DRAM Memory Mapping
BGS alt	Enabled	BankGroupSwap at Advanced > AMD CBS > UMC Common Options > DRAM Memory Mapping
FCLK	1600	Extreme Tweaker

Termination Block Omega	Rec	Alt 1	Alt 2	BIOS Location: All under Extreme Tweaker > DRAM Timing Control
procODT	34.3	36.9	32
RTT_NOM	OFF	OFF	OFF
RTT_WR	OFF	OFF	OFF
RTT_PARK	RZQ/5(48)	RZQ/5(48)	RZQ/5(48)

CAD_BUS Block Omega	Rec	Alt 1	Alt 2	BIOS Location: All under Extreme Tweaker > DRAM Timing Control
CAD_BUS ClkDrv	24	24	24	"MemCadBusClkDrvStren"?
CAD_BUS AddrCmdDrv	20	20	24	"MemCadBusAddrCmdDrvStren"?
CAD_BUS CsOdtDrv	20	24	24	"MemCadBusCsOdtDrvStren"?
CAD_BUS CkeDrv	24	24	24	"MemCadBusCkeDrvStren"?

DRAM Calculator's Advanced Page

Main Voltages	Rec	Alt	BIOS Location: All under Extreme Tweaker > Tweaker's Paradise
VTT DDR Voltage min	0.673	0.678	No min/max field
VTT DDR Voltage max	0.6765	0.6815	No min/max field
Boot DRAM Voltage	1.350	1.360	Can't Find
Vref (CHA/CHB)	0.675	0.7425	DRAM Ctrl Ref Voltage on [ChA/ChB] at Extreme Tweaker > Tweaker’s Paradise

Debug Voltages	Rec	Alt 1	Alt 2	BIOS Location: All under Extreme Tweaker > Tweaker's Paradise
VDDP Voltage	900	855	815
VPP Voltage	2.5	2.48	2.525	"VPP_MEM Voltage"?
PLL Voltage	1.8	1.77	1.83	"PLL reference voltage" or "1.8V PLL Voltage" under Extreme Tweaker?

CAD_BUS Timings	Rec	Alt	BIOS Location: All under Extreme Tweaker > DRAM Timing Control
CAD_BUS AddrCmd	0	53	"MemAddrCmdSetup"?
CAD_BUS CsOdt	0	53	"MemCsOdtSetup"?
CAD_BUS Cke	0	53	"MemCkeSetup"?

Memory Interleaving + Tweaks	Value	BIOS Location
Memory Interleaving Size	2	Advanced > AMD CBS > DF Common Options > Memory Addressing
Memory Interleaving	Channel	Advanced > AMD CBS > DF Common Options > Memory Addressing
Channel Interleaving Hash	Enabled	Can't Find
DRAM R1-R4 Tune	0/63	Extreme Tweaker > Tweaker's Paradise
L1 Stream HW Prefetcher	Enabled	Advanced > AMD CBS > CPU Common Options > Prefetcher
L2 Stream HW Prefetcher	Enabled	Advanced > AMD CBS > CPU Common Options > Prefetcher
Super I/O Clock Skew	Disabled	Can't Find
Opcache	Enabled	Can't Find
Spread Spectrum	Enabled	"VRM Spread Spectrum" under Extreme Tweaker > External Digi+ Power Control or "SB Clock Spread Spectrum" in unknown location (found with F9)?
Memory Clear	Disabled	Advanced > AMD CBS > DF Common Options

PMU Training	Value	BIOS Location: All under Advanced > AMD CBS > DDR4 Common Options > Phy Configuration > PMU Training
DFE Read Training	Enabled
FFE Write Training	Enabled
PMU Pattern Bits Control	Manual
PMU Pattern Bits	A or 10
MR6VrefDQ Control	Auto
CPU Vref Training Seed Control	Auto

DRAM Calculator's Power Supply Systems Page

CPU/VDDSOC/DRAM	Best DRAM Stability	For CPU too	BIOS Location: All under Extreme Tweaker > External Digi+ Power Control
CPU Load-Line Calibration	Level 2/3	Level 3/4
CPU Current Capability	110-130%	130-140%
CPU VRM Switching Frequency	Manual	Same as for DRAM
Voltage Frequency	200/300	300/400
CPU Power Duty Control	T.Probe	Same as for DRAM
CPU Power Phase Control	Power Phase Response	Same as for DRAM
CPU Power Thermal Control	120	Same as for DRAM
Manual Adjustment	Regular	Ultra Fast
VDDSOC Load-Line Calibration	Level 2/3	Same as for DRAM
VDDSOC Current Capability	120.00%	Same as for DRAM
VDDSOC Switching Frequency	Manual	Same as for DRAM
Switching Frequency (Fixed) (KHz)	300/400	Same as for DRAM
Phase Control	Manual/Optimized	Same as for DRAM
DRAM Current Capability	100.00%	120.00%
DRAM Power Phase Control	Extreme	Same as for DRAM
DRAM Switching Frequency	Manual	Same as for DRAM
Switching Frequency (Fixed) (KHz)	300/400	Same as for DRAM

[RedSector73]

Did you get this working / do you need help.

I'm not sure from second post. Your ram is Samsung b-die.

[ationfictons]

Thanks for the offer. I got about 2/3 of the way through without any problems whatsoever. I was seeing about a 6% improvement in memory benchmarks, but they appeared mostly after simply entering those new timings at the top of the list. Adding the various voltages and non-t-value things didn't seem to be getting me anything more. So, I just stopped. For now, I've gone back to my regular old DOCP settings. I'm not sure if overclocking the memory is worth it at a system level (as opposed to a memory benchmark level), especially as I'm so clueless that I'm doing nothing but blindly following a recipe. I think I'll just spend a good amount of time trying to actually understand what's going with this before picking it up again. At least it should be easier to continue since I've found where most of the settings live in the BIOS.

But, again, thanks for the offer.

EDIT: oops. Maybe you can answer some of the questions I noted in my previous post:

• Is the Calculator's "SOC Voltage" the same as the BIOS' "CPU SOC Voltage" under Extreme Tweaker?
• Is the Calculator's "CAD_BUS ClkDrv" the BIOS' "MemCadBusClkDrvStren" under Extreme Tweaker > DRAM Timing Control?
• Is the Calculator's "CAD_BUS AddrCmdDrv" the BIOS' "MemCadBusAddrCmdDrvStren" under Extreme Tweaker > DRAM Timing Control?
• Is the Calculator's "CAD_BUS CsOdtDrv" the BIOS' "MemCadBusCsOdtDrvStren" under Extreme Tweaker > DRAM Timing Control?
• Is the Calculator's "CAD_BUS CkeDrv" the BIOS' "MemCadBusCkeDrvStren" under Extreme Tweaker > DRAM Timing Control?
• Is the Calculator's "CAD_BUS AddrCmd" the BIOS' "MemAddrCmdSetup" under Extreme Tweaker > DRAM Timing Control?
• Is the Calculator's "CAD_BUS CsOdt" the BIOS' "MemCsOdtSetup" under Extreme Tweaker > DRAM Timing Control?
• Is the Calculator's "CAD_BUS Cke" the BIOS' "MemCkeSetup" under Extreme Tweaker > DRAM Timing Control?
• Is the Calculator's "VPP Voltage" the BIOS' "VPP_MEM Voltage" under Extreme Tweaker > Tweaker's Paradise?
• Is the Calculator's "PLL Voltage" the BIOS' "PLL reference voltage" under Extreme Tweaker > Tweaker's Paradise or "1.8V PLL Voltage" under Extreme Tweaker?
• Is the Calculator's "Spread Spectrum" the BIOS' "VRM Spread Spectrum" under Extreme Tweaker > External Digi+ Power Control or "SB Clock Spread Spectrum" in some unknown location (found with F9)? If the latter, do you know where that actually is?

[RedSector73]

here, watch this



You appear to be over-thinking this and free performance with near to no risk, is always worth dialing in `imo.

[ationfictons]

Thanks. I'd already seen that video. I primarily worked with the material in 1usmus' AMD Ryzen Memory Tweaking & Overclocking Guide. Specifically the things and diagrams on page 5:

https://www.techpowerup.com/review/a...g-guide/5.html

But, as you noted, I'm probably over-thinking this. Doing his "Part 0" (basically the "t-values") seems to get the vast majority of the overclocking done. I used his TM5 0.12 program to stress test after each stage and never had an error. But, I was still worried that if I didn't go through all 5 "parts" and enter all the suggested values from the Calculator, I'd be leaving something hanging.

[owcraftsman]

I recommend poking around in the Advanced Tab in Bios scroll down to the bottom "AMD Overclocking" where you will be greeted with a prompt to accept. You'll be greeted with 8 subtopics. VDDP & VDDG Voltage Control among them and I suspect all you are missing can be found there.



There is another alternative to adjusting VDDP & VDDG which is using Ryzen Master. The only problem I have with it is we have no idea what all the changes it makes other than what we manually adjust through the app. I know this much, I can run my system at 4450 all cores which are 3hrs Real Bench Stress Test stable by making two changes in the app but the same two change made to the bios fails to boot. To me that is a clear indication there is way more going on there than we see.



This may also answer the question of which SOC voltage to change. It makes sense to me to change the VDDCR SOC voltage other than system-wide SOC.

To be clear, I'm still on 1105 bios and unless I find a compelling reason to update to 1201 I will stick with it.
In any case, this is my effort to avoid confusion.

I understand release notes indicate " Update auto-rules for CPU and Memory overclocking" but we are not using auto are we?
Of course, there is always the unknown that may prove valuable so I never say never.
I've been overclocking for 20+ years and as a rule of thumb, I never update bios unless I need to. Back when you could replace the EPROM chip too. I even had Tski program a chip and send it to me once for an NF4 board.

I want to thank you @ationfictons for all the effort you have put forth here and offer you whatever input I can to help see it all to a successful end.

I too am looking to dot all my i's and cross all my t's before committing the tuned timings to bios and testing.

Suffice to say, I have a vested interest.

I'm working with Trident Z NEO memory specifically F4-3600C16Q-32GTZN
Using Thaiphoon my memory shows up as DJR which is not an available option in the drop-down menu. Imagine my concern so, I reached out to 1usmus through twitter and he responded within 2 days. I have no personal relationship with him/her and was quite grateful for the reply. Turns out we can use the "Hynix CJR" option when DJR parts are detected. Although I remain a bit skeptical I feel a bit better proceeding.



At this point I will continue working on the unanswered question so maybe we can cleanup post 2


I think I found CAD_BUS settings
Advanced>AMD CBS

I found VPP Voltage setting but in an unconventional way.
From In Bios tap "F9" type in "VPP" in the resulting dialog enter the value desired.

I think VDDCR may be adjusted by a CPU offset voltage vs an actual enty in bios. ATM I don't have a tool to monitor changes so I cannot be sure.

[ationfictons]

In the end, I decided to go (roughly) with various bits of advice I got from here and other places and only overclock my memory up through the Calculator's CAD_BUS Block Resistances using the FAST settings for its rated 3200 speed. For my particular G.Skill F4-3200C14D-16GTZ DDR4 memory those numbers, and their locations, work out to be:

T-variables	3200 FAST t-values	BIOS Location: All under Extreme Tweaker > DRAM Timing Control
tCL	14	DRAM CAS# Latency
tRCDWR	14	Switch order
tRCDRD	14	Switch order
tRP	14	DRAM RAS# PRE Time
tRAS	28	DRAM RAS# ACT Time
tRC	42
tRRDS	4
tRRDL	5
tFAW	16
tWTRS	4
tWTRL	12
tWR	10
tRDRD SCL	2
tWRWR SCL	2
tRFC	252
tRFC (alt)	256	Can’t find - ignored
tCWL	14
tRTP	8
tRDWR	7
tWRRD	3
tWRWR SC	1
tWRWR SD	7
tWRWR DD	7
tRDRD SC	1
tRDRD SD	5
tRDRD DD	5
tCKE	1

Voltage Block (voltage range)	3200 FAST Rec	BIOS Location: All under Extreme Tweaker
DRAM Voltage	1.365
SOC Voltage	1.025	"CPU SOC Voltage"?
cLDO VDDG Voltage	0.9	Can't Find - ignored
cLDO VDDP Voltage	0.9	Wrong Units? 700 vs 0.9? Ignored

Misc Items	3200 FAST Value	BIOS Location
Power Down mode	Disabled	Extreme Tweaker > DRAM Timing Control
Gear Down mode	Disabled	Extreme Tweaker > DRAM Timing Control
Command Rate	1T	Extreme Tweaker > DRAM Timing Control
BGS	Disabled	BankGroupSwap at Advanced > AMD CBS > UMC Common Options > DRAM Memory Mapping
BGS alt	Enabled	BankGroupSwap Alt at Advanced > AMD CBS > UMC Common Options > DRAM Memory Mapping
FCLK	1600	Extreme Tweaker

Termination Block Resistances	3200 SAFE/FAST Rec	BIOS Location: All under Extreme Tweaker > DRAM Timing Control
procODT	34.3
RTT_NOM	OFF
RTT_WR	OFF
RTT_PARK	RZQ/5(48)

CAD_BUS Block Resistances	3200 SAFE/FAST Rec	BIOS Location: All under Extreme Tweaker > DRAM Timing Control
CAD_BUS ClkDrv	24	"MemCadBusClkDrvStren"?
CAD_BUS AddrCmdDrv	20	"MemCadBusAddrCmdDrvStren"?
CAD_BUS CsOdtDrv	20	"MemCadBusCsOdtDrvStren"?
CAD_BUS CkeDrv	24	"MemCadBusCkeDrvStren"?

Basically, the only items I skipped were the cLDO VDDG Voltage and cLDO VDDP Voltage settings. Everything breezed through my stress testing and benchmarks without problem. I just updated to the 1201 BIOS and in the process reset all my BIOS settings. I considered just doing the memory overclocking in Ryzen Master but decided to stay with doing it in the BIOS (and that's fairly easy, now, since I know where the settings are). Since I do see those cLDO setting right there under RM's "Voltage Controls" area, I've been considering setting up a profile just to include those changes. But, since I'm running fine, I decided to be lazy and leave things alone. Also, I've seen posts mentioning that making changes in RM means it sets the values in the AMD Overclocking area and that area doesn't get cleared with setting the BIOS back to defaults. If something gets badly messed up doing things that way, I'd have to re-flash the BIOS to recover:

https://www.reddit.com/r/Amd/comment...memory_oc_and/

BTW: my benchmarks are mostly by eyeball, but according to the tests I ran, I'm getting about half a percent to a full percent more performance just from updating the BIOS from 1105 to 1201. It's really not worth mentioning (it's small enough to be considered noise), but it seemed consistent.

[RedSector73]

The results are from testing the Ryzen Dram Calculator Fast Settings on Samsung b-die certified 4133 at various speeds.
Ryzen 3900x with Ram 2x8 PVR416G413C9K https://viper.patriotmemory.com/prod...ormance-memory

DDR4@3600

https://www.userbenchmark.com/UserRun/22489520
3600 Full Profile Fast Settings - https://my.pcloud.com/publink/show?c...RJadVA054CDVu7


DDR4@3666

https://www.userbenchmark.com/UserRun/22489047
3666 Full Profile Fast Settings - https://my.pcloud.com/publink/show?c...BRMij2fV3PAKLV


DDR4@3733

https://www.userbenchmark.com/UserRun/22488174
3733 Full Profile Fast Settings - https://my.pcloud.com/publink/show?c...kdg8A4cLE6NIXV

DDR4@3800

https://www.userbenchmark.com/UserRun/22490645
3800 Full Profile Fast Settings - https://my.pcloud.com/publink/show?c...VMx9tiXuKiEzRV




Notes:-

I have attached the full profile bios settings for each speed and made adjustments to some from the calculators suggestions. I run my system DDR4@3600 Fast Profile (daily driver) and I did stability test every profile prior to posting (they all work in my system, yours maybe different story bla bla bla no warranties this works for you / at your own risk).

Strangely the M2 nvme drive speed was affected in some of the runs, with 3600 & 3800 passes being the exceptions.
If anyone has ideas to why or what to adjust to get more consistent speed from M2 nvme across testing. I would be very interested.

Did not bother with certified 4100 @ 4133 DOCP profiles or faster clocks, maybe in the future.





Hope this might be of help to the more adventurous of us.

[RedSector73]

I checked the nvme passes with two different benchmarks at various speed tested above and they both show a normal linear growth with speed increases along with the RAM.

Not sure why userbench is showing what it does, but it does throw the scoring out as well (no other benchmark program captures the userbench shown nvme scaling with ram issue). Strange issue, I noticed it while ago but never checked till today. I wonder if this effects Intel and other amd systems ?