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Thread: Apex XIII bios

  1. #11
    ROG Enthusiast Array Grimpak PC Specs
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    Quote Originally Posted by kvarq View Post
    noticed something weird with the 0903 “official” bios
    trying to find some SA and IO voltages for my 4000C16 2x16 kit (which on Z490 / Apex XII went down easily till 1.25/1.3V for XMP), I tried lots of values between 1.2 and even 1.5V for IO and 1.6V for SA; NOTHING helped, tried also some skew stuff, but lost my patience)... anyway, to update these voltages I had to SHUT down the computer, 5-6 restarts or more, these are not willing to update at all, current values being from the old setting

    *

    I read a lot these days threads on forums, so indeed seems that something is wrong with Bios in the end...*
    I kinda noticed that. Any change that actually required a hard reset, I had to actually turn off the PSU and let it discharge, otherwise the "infinite-insta-reboot" thingy happens. Thing is, after I did that, the training did take some time, but it did something right, cuz it managed to boot nicely, and after some testing, seemed that it did got a bit more stable.

  2. #12
    ROG Enthusiast Array kvarq PC Specs
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    well, that's cute...
    two bios-es have been uploaded yesterday


    inside the archives, the *.cap files have different dates - 0902 seems saved on 8 July, 0903 modified on 26 June, so 0902 looks the newer one - I wanted to check them when I'll get home, but NVM, checked them with hex editors and the *.cap files are in the end IDENTICAL with the beta versions...
    (see post #3)

    first time I thought that finally it is happening what I suggested some time ago - one is for 10th and the other for 11th
    or at least the beta versions previously released which have been slightly corrected / updated - would not the first time when they release different stuff but rename it the same it's pretty much a mess for years on Asus support pages, probably someone forgot to actually put the right stuff inside the zip files =))

    also back in January for Apex XII they issued dome bios-es, changing statements every few days "beta" or not, but was in fact it was the same stuff inside, and finally they eventually removed them for good :P 2004 was good stuff for XII...

  3. #13
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    I think they may have built some z590 board while working from home I have z490 Apex, z590 Apex and z590 Hero and the z590 Hero does slightly better than the z590 Apex for mem OC using 11900k. Also with 11900k in z490 Apex I could run SR b die 5033+, in z590 Apex it is done at 4800 with all the same components. Haven't tried SR in z590 Hero, might have to see if it does past 4800.

    Z490 Apex is better for SR mem OC using 10th gen CPUs as I cannot get 1t working at 4533 on z590 Apex. Must be board variations because some guys really like the z590 Apex but mine not so much. Also the fact bios flashback does not update the microcode on z590 Apex is not good. But it updates the microcode on the z590 Hero I have using flashback.
    Last edited by bscool; 07-11-2021 at 11:24 AM.

  4. #14
    ROG Enthusiast Array kvarq PC Specs
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    "working from home" - good one =))

    yeah, I think now binning of the boards also got important, probably variations are more... incisive this generation
    on my Apex the 2x16 kit fails within 10 mins in GSAT, on another same kit needs 2hrs 55min to fail... same bios, same settings etc

    on your mobo you noticed 0902 being better than 0903 in the end?
    (can't understand why they uploaded the very same day the two beta versions on the support page :P)

    I honestly don't know what to do, they uploaded in July beta bioses from May, so I kinda lost my hope with these guys, to buy again the Z490 Apex XII or to buy Z590 MSI or OC formula from Asrock - apparently MSI is better than expected with 2x16
    obviously I'll lose lots of money selling this sh*t SH...

  5. #15
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    I haven't messed with the z590 Apex for a bit, the only difference I noticed between 902 and 903 was microcode but I could be wrong. I know on z590 Hero 902 is better than older bios versions if you use ABT is will clock 51 vs other bios did 50 from what I saw when testing. I think I read some people say on z590 Apex 903 needs more io or sa for mem OC than 902.

    Also the latter couple bios give a boost in copy verse the first couple bios versions, even setting timings manually. I think it is 707 and later that give copy a fair boost when measuring with aida64. I confirmed it on both z590 Apex and Hero using 11th gen. I don't think it effect 10th gen CPUs in those MBs from what I remember.

    I would have gotten a z590 Unify X to try but it took too long to come out. A week after I got the Z590 Hero Newegg released the Unify X and I didn't feel like sending the Hero back to Amazon plus I had already installed it and started using it.

    With all that rambling I would use 10th gen CPUs with z490 and 11th gen with z590. Just from the playing around I have done with a z490 Apex, z590 Apex/Hero and z490 Unify with both gen CPUs they work best when paired 10th/z490 and 11th/z590.

    You said z590 MSI does better with 2x16? Is that with 10th gen or 11th gen CPU? From the bench's i have seen on the Asrock I would not bother. I think it is a backwards step if anything a lateral at best.

    It seems like you may have a bad board or something. I could run the same clocks and timings on z590 Apex using 10th gen(10700k) and 2x16 as on z490 Apex(4400c16-17-17). I just noticed the difference in SR and trying 1t@4266+.

    Have tried contacting Asus about an RMA or can you still return the MB?
    Last edited by bscool; 07-12-2021 at 08:32 AM.

  6. #16
    ROG Enthusiast Array kvarq PC Specs
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    Yeah, same settings I had on Apex XII were not working on Apex XIII, but that's no surprise, since I read lots of similar cases of 10th and Z590, but also with 11th.
    Also the boot issues, the classic F7 error, the power stuff, USB errors etc. seemed to be common for Z590, so it's not my board only, also read about Hero, Extreme etc.
    Could be bios, or worse, board designs, or maybe just bad batches.
    Clearly bios still needs lots of work.
    Asus quality is a big FAIL now.

    Of course I wanted to return this crap after few days, you're not paying 500 EUR for an unfinished product, but it seems that I bought the board from a dodgy online store, computeruniverse, based in Germany. I should have read the trustpilot reviews first. Also what I received seemed to be used before, did not receive all the accessories, found out on Asus website that warranty started end of March, but I bought it beginning of May. They're not replying to emails etc. At least I got something, others were literally scammed.

    Anyways, I also opened a ticket on Asus support page, after lots of e-mails they said that probably it is the best to RMA it, then Asus Germany was willing to RMA the board, but picking is from Germany-Austria only. I also contacted the local Asus from my country but they cannot RMA it, since it was not bought locally.
    Asus have this policy with RMA not being international at all. That's bloody Asus policy =))

    Anyways, for my 2x16, XMP 16-16-16-36 seems to not be working at all on XIII, no matter how hard I'm trying to tune voltages and settings, although should be just one click for XMP, and I said before other Apex XIII struggles the same with the same kit, fails later though, but in my case loading XMP and then modifying 17-17-17-37 seems to be rock solid, as well on the other Apex XIII the same, this seems the temporary solution. I tried lots of bios versions, from 0106 to 0903.
    The very same 2x16 kit is solid on Apex XII with an older bios, with the latest one is a bit debatable. Binning for that particular kit is debatable, but not even bumping VRAM to 1.45V on Apex XIII is not a go.
    But anyways, I had few 2x16 kits which on Apex XII were rock solid in GSAT now they fail on XIII, even in the included memtest.

  7. #17
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    Seems like that is probably why it was returned by someone else as it is defective. Even the z590 Hero I have will run 4400c16-17-17 2x16 with 10700k. I switched back to 11900k or would post screen shots. I didn't take any when I had the 10700k installed.

    I am being really nit picky when I say mine is not that good. But yours not running/stable 4000c16 2x16 XMP is not expectable.

  8. #18
    ROG Enthusiast Array kvarq PC Specs
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    flashed the 1007 on my Apex XIII

    0903


    1007


    same stuff with the 7F error, the USB issue (when a third device is plugged in, sometimes the keyboard is disconnecting for some reason)
    differences noticed - EC version RKL updated from 014 to 015, PTT setting from disabled to enabled, and I can see "Trusted Computing" in 1007, was not there for me in 0903
    probably I'll switch those off, since I'm on 21H1, no intention for W11 too soon, probably when it will be really out...

    I had also a false alarm, thought that after restart latencies for my 2x16 kit have been updated to XMP values 16-16-16-36, but like the voltage stuff, it actually needs few proper restarts to be properly updated... so it passed a quick GSAT test, which never happened so far with any 2x16 kit, not even 4000C19 etc., but with the wrong latencies

    what's still weird though, the 4000C19 kit on XMP does NOT pass GSAT, fails under 20 mins let's say, but the 4000C16 kit when latencies adjusted to 17-17-17-37 instead 16-16-16-36 (XMP) proved to be rock solid

    so it seems that there are still issues with the dual rank on this motherboard

  9. #19
    ROG Enthusiast Array Grimpak PC Specs
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    Quote Originally Posted by kvarq View Post
    flashed the 1007 on my Apex XIII

    0903


    1007


    same stuff with the 7F error, the USB issue (when a third device is plugged in, sometimes the keyboard is disconnecting for some reason)
    differences noticed - EC version RKL updated from 014 to 015, PTT setting from disabled to enabled, and I can see "Trusted Computing" in 1007, was not there for me in 0903
    probably I'll switch those off, since I'm on 21H1, no intention for W11 too soon, probably when it will be really out...

    I had also a false alarm, thought that after restart latencies for my 2x16 kit have been updated to XMP values 16-16-16-36, but like the voltage stuff, it actually needs few proper restarts to be properly updated... so it passed a quick GSAT test, which never happened so far with any 2x16 kit, not even 4000C19 etc., but with the wrong latencies

    what's still weird though, the 4000C19 kit on XMP does NOT pass GSAT, fails under 20 mins let's say, but the 4000C16 kit when latencies adjusted to 17-17-17-37 instead 16-16-16-36 (XMP) proved to be rock solid

    so it seems that there are still issues with the dual rank on this motherboard
    better than before tho...

  10. #20
    ROG Enthusiast Array 74lobster PC Specs
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    I have not undestood...
    This beta bios 1007 is usable or has problems ?

    Now I have installed the 902 bios version, in my ROG MAXIMUS XIII HERO mobo: I need to update the bios or not ?

    Thanks in advance.

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