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  1. #1
    ROG Enthusiast Array XZEMi's Avatar
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    Power Supply Basic Facts.

    Fact a computer runs cooler and is less likely to present errors with a good quality power supply.

    Fact anything over 850 watts is complete hype with the exception of dual processor server systems or systems with more than two graphics cards.

    Fact processors and video cards once again are becomming more energy efficient with the exception of AMD at the time of this posting but AMD is soon to follow. This means less power is required.

    Fact gold rated power supplies run cooler than bronze rated and platinum is just a way to charge you more for little differance over gold.

    Fact Seasonic has always been a well regarded power supply company amongst all the new brands.

    Fact Corsair are likely rebranded slightly modified Seasonics.

    Fact Antec made good power supplies then started making worse ones but are now back in the game making pretty decent stuff since Delta Electronics now makes their power supplies.

  2. #2
    ROG Guru: Diamond Belt Array Zka17's Avatar
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    Wow, man! And you got these from your 112 years (from your basic info) of experience?!

    "Fact a computer runs cooler and is less likely to present errors with a good quality power supply." I agree with the "...is less likely to present errors with a good quality power supply." part, but I have some thoughts about "Fact a computer runs cooler..." - this depends on the case design. Most of the modern cases are design in a way that the psu has it's own air circulation: getting air from outside (bottom) and exhausting outside (rear). In this case, how the computer run hot, even with a hot psu?!

    "Fact anything over 850 watts is complete hype with the exception of dual processor server systems or systems with more than two graphics cards." - pretty much, I agree. But, hey, do you know that feeling to know that you have more reserves? Specially, when you're planning to have an upgrade - like put in more graphic cards, OC, get more fans, or more pumps for your WC.

    "Fact processors and video cards once again are becomming more energy efficient with the exception of AMD at the time of this posting but AMD is soon to follow. This means less power is required." - Well, see above! Heavy OC and/or multiple high-end graphic cards still require more power...

    "Fact gold rated power supplies run cooler than bronze rated and platinum is just a way to charge you more for little differance over gold." - I would be interested in founding out how did you get to this conclusion! As I said above, why is the psu temp matter if it has completely isolated airflow from the rest of the system? Gold rated psus are higher quality than bronze rated ones (at least that's the idea making them), as platinum rating is higher than the gold one - it depends on your pocket which one you will get. But let me tell you something! You may have even the highest platinum rated psu if you don't have proper power protection (like a good ups)...

    "Fact Seasonic has always been a well regarded power supply company amongst all the new brands." - OK, so?

    "Fact Corsair are likely rebranded slightly modified Seasonics." - So, what's the problem? If "Seasonic has always been a well regarded power supply company amongst all the new brands."

    "Fact Antec made good power supplies then started making worse ones but are now back in the game making pretty decent stuff since Delta Electronics now makes their power supplies." - If you say so... Never had any experience with Antec psus, but will keep this in my mind, in case i will need an other psu.

  3. #3
    Shut Up Stupid! Array DaemonCantor's Avatar
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    Well I'm glad to have read this and now I guess all of the years I've been a computer Technician working in just about all phases is meaningless due to the fact that all I've ever created or helped in creating is nothing but a fabrication for the masses.

    Truth...AMD has been creating Power Efficient Parts for over 8 years now with better Power Curves than nVidia.
    If you control the Power input with a good Quality UPS your system will run better and smother with less parts burning out and less system error(BSOD's) and others plus consume about 5% to 10% less power. Proven 1 source: http://3dfs.com/technology/white-paper but articles on this can be found all over the place and has been talked about since 1986 when I worked for Mac Donald Douglas Aircraft as part of the IT Department in R&D.
    Seasonic has been a fairly good PSU supplier but there are very few companies purchasing from them due to COST. but getting a Good Quality Single Rail PSU is always worth the time it takes to do the research.
    Cooling...A PSU no matter what brand or Quality will create Heat it's called Physics but if you run a PSU at only 50% your going to create less heat because the Electronics are running more Efficiently that at 80% which also means that when you combine the Power needs of ALL Main components which comes up to around 600watts on a Modern System your going to need a 1200watt PSU to get the 50% usage and then you start adding more Drives, Fans, Expansion Cards this value goes up. but the best case efficiency mark is around the 70% mark which still puts PSU requirements at over 850watts.
    Final point is 'If your saying to purchase Good Quality Components then you are very correct' and I applaud you in this and everyone should look at what they are spending their money on.

  4. #4
    ROG Guru: Diamond Belt Array Zka17's Avatar
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    DaemonCantor: don't worry, your efforts were NOT meaningless!

    "A PSU no matter what brand or Quality will create Heat it's called Physics" - you're absolutely right! All I was saying is that heat won't get inside the case (at least with today's designs), so won't add anything to whole system's temperatures. However, blocking the proper vent of a psu, that will be hot! - not only the psu, but on your wallet too...

    Let's face it, 600W "on a Modern System" is a little bit overkill... Or not? Running stress tests (Prime95, Furmark) on a Core i7-980X at 4.6GHz, an Asus DirectCu II TOP at 1GHZ, an H100 pump and 7 fans (plus an SSD, HDD - but these anyway don't count during stress testing) barely reaching 450W measured on the ups (monitor, modem also connected to it)... This is meaning 450W at full load. I could drop in my GTX480s in 3 way SLI, but that would not be anymore a "modern system", I guess... So, for this system a 850W psu would be just fine - right?

    But, as I said earlier, I like to have reserves - I'm running now an AX1200... And I think a lot of people here actually would agree with me - specially because of those GTX480s (they are really power-hungry).

    I completely agree: "Good Quality Components" with a "Good Quality UPS"!

  5. #5
    Shut Up Stupid! Array DaemonCantor's Avatar
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    Yes I know that a 600watt system is a little more than typical but then again I can't start my CHIVF with 1 HD, 1 Optical, and 1 GPU with less than 350watts and that's with a low end GPU at that....My system uses around 600watts with the ATI Radeon HD5870 and that's about normal now days unless you get into Intel and some of their CPU's are only 90watts where as mine is 145watts baseline. On the Price Per Watt Intel still has AMD beat but hopefully not for long. So 600watts isn't that far off maybe only 10% and I'm just getting by with a 975watt PSU truthfully and because of the load I'm expecting to need a replacement within a year.

    As to the heat being expelled Hell Yes the newer Cases expels heat and manage Heat Zones way better than even 2 years ago plus the fact as you put it the PSU Thermal Zone is removed with Bottom Mounted PSU's now...Good Catch there.

  6. #6
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    wowzers ... hmm

    Wow .. i have to say to the person that started the thread .. hmmmm. I have 1200 watt power supply for my system .. go to a good wattage calculator .. and with my system i will need 1100 when i install the liquid cooling. So i have to say .. 800 watts is a waste. I guess my math must be all wrong. lol. Read info on profile. Plus before i upgraded from a 4 core amd to an 8 core fx 850 watts was not enough to get me over 4.2 ghz on my6 6 core I had. To me .. more power means (especially from an overclockers standpoint) more stable power .. ie less spikes in voltage. I think psus are the problem when overclocking along with heat .. which makes it difficult to diagnose. But again .. More power means a more stable system which makes for easier diagnosis when first starting to overclock. I hope all take this post with respect (which is the way it is intended).

    Richard

  7. #7
    ROG Guru: Diamond Belt Array Zka17's Avatar
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    Well, oneawesomeseabee, would you please share the "good wattage calculator" you used to get those values? Did you effectively measure how much power your system draws? I mean, not by calculators (how much it should draw), but real measuring tools (how much is actually drawing)? It was long time age, when I used AMD-based system, but I doubt that with that configuration you can draw 1100W...

  8. #8
    Shut Up Stupid! Array DaemonCantor's Avatar
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    I don't, the AMD Dozer 6 core is rated at 185watts, the CHVF or CHVT takes 225 watts, plus 80watts to start an HD and then they drip to around 45watts idling then add 45watts for your standard Optical Drive...Hmmmm lets see that's 535watts alone with out a GPU and I don't care if it has external Power or not they all start at 185watts so if you add that your looking at 720watts just to start the system and Idle does bring it down but even them it will depend on how much power savings the idle mode gives you ie: Intel system probably idles at around 450wats where as a Dozer idles at around 600watts (mostly due to the CPU). Now you change up to like an ATI Radeon HD5870 which AMD even states is over 250watts now your pushing between 700watts at idle to 900 watts running at full tilt then add a second 5870 to the mix in Crossfire and you've easily broken 1000watts of power. People think that the CPU is the biggest hog on a system but in reality it's the North Bridge and South bridge that are they both run at about 100watts each plus the Sound Chips which are another Power Sink with the AD and DA converters....where as on the Drives it's the motors that pull all of the juice...
    Last edited by DaemonCantor; 04-26-2012 at 07:23 PM. Reason: Oppps a mistype

  9. #9
    ROG Enthusiast Array XZEMi's Avatar
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    Hmm I did not figure people would actually debate my simple post to help those who would have no idea what power supply to get and just go buy the 1300 watt one because its the biggest they can get. Oh well just a little something to consider if you buy quality you get quality but it is application dependant. For instance you dont want a seasonic gold modular power supply in a small form case because it will not always run its fan and evacuate the heat. You would be better off getting a cheaper supply that has a fan constantly running. And yeah overclocking I managed to get 4.2 ghz+ with the FX8120 on a 430watt corsair ps and gtx560ti. I dont have the video but if enough people are interrested I can probably make one.

  10. #10
    Shut Up Stupid! Array DaemonCantor's Avatar
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    Poor lit'el Corsair....I hope he didn't abuse you too much....yea you probably did! you were using the OverCurrent circuit which will give up to an additional 200watts depending on PSU design and yes I've seen an Antec Earth Watt 350 put out 600watts but it only held together for about an hour and then it fried. and I couldn't duplicate your feat with out Hardware damage...

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